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This is being done by tightening credit standards. Even the police there are not armed. Leading industry awards return with renewed focus on raising standards.

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August 1, at 6: Still very curious how that camera performed in real world situations. Think of it as a Toyota Kluger Ute. Meaning that the US Gov can legally walk away from any of the fraudulent dealings that have transpired. It just feels really nice to drive! But we have a way out — we can put our hopes of being saved on the World Government click it for funaccording to a Professor of International Politics at University of Western Australia.

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Over the past two decades, at the behest of powerful interest groups and lobbyist, Congress dismantled and restructured the then existing regulatory restrictions that protected the economy from the text book situation which you described.

It was predicted many years ago… screamed from the mountaintops for anyone to hear. But no one paid attention. When the regulation and rule of law are manipulated, the eventual outcome of those changes are predictable.

As for runs on the bank… your illustration is a far cry from anything other than an illusion. While it is true that banks do not carry ready reserves of Cash on Hand to cover the cumulative balances of their accounts, the monies of the accounts themselves are properly recorded in the banks ledgers.

Customers would not need to demand the balance in full, in cash. They could demand a cashiers check, or they could simply walk into another financial institution of their choosing and write a draft or check to transfer their monies from their old bank to their new institution.

In the event of a bank failure, the proper action would have been to let the bank fail, at which point its assets would have been seized by the government, it deposits covered to an extent by FDIC, and then liquidated or managed in probate to recover losses on behalf of the injured parties.

No Bail Outs would have been required. But there would have been a full accounting and investigation of corruption, mismanagement, maleficent, etc. Let there be no doubt that our current economic crisis is very real, far from over, and deliberately engineered.

What are the short and long term implications? As for credit and liquidity, Wall Street is flush, but Main Street has dried up. TARP funds and various bailouts have been used, not to extend credit to Main Street, but rather to starve out the middle class, small and medium businesses, local banks and middle America so that those whom have access and control of credit may buy up practically anything and everything of value for pennies on the dollar.

The gains are privatized and the losses are socialized. In other words, importing cheap labor and exporting manufacturing and industry. Ironically this only excelerates the phenomena. Ultimately, this incomprehensible level of debt may only be solved one of two ways, if not both: Hmm… have you been watching the news lately?

What treaties have been pending on the horizon? Please tell me that you are at least somewhat familiar with the organizations that advise and create the policies that our Congress reviews and our President enacts as policy?

Not merely the consolidation of wealth, but a consolidation of Power. The Federal Reserve itself has undergone consolidation. And soon… as we continue marching towards globalization via Conquest and Treaty and the expansion of Power… Our National Sovereignty.

And although I most certainly agree with you and applaud you on your preference for direct money creation where Congress creates money to pay for infrastructure to expand the economy, alas, there too you have unwittingly overlooked or intentionally omitted several key details.

Although Congress does have the constitutional authority to mint coin and regulate the value of domestic and foreign monies, and does stimulate the economy with monies spent on militaries, infrastructure, and commerce, it ultimately can not and should not be responsible for insuring our economy.

That said, for better or for worse, with our burgeoning debt our prosperity is being washed away. Expanding the money supply with fiat currency is a devils game. The only thing that truly generates wealth is labor and resources.

You can not exploit resources without access, be it public or private, to land. Be it beef, beans, or bread, or be it lumber, steel, silver, or gold, without land the supply to resources is severed, and with it the capacitance for manufacturing and industry are also severed.

We could easily transform our fiat money supply into that of one based entirely upon industrial and agricultural commodities, in addition to gold, silver, and other precious metals.

But there in lies the crutch. For mining and harvesting, refinement and manufacturing, and for transportation. What, pray tell, has our current economic crises entailed?

Commodities and Industry, I. Main Street and Jobs. Credit, cash, and liquidity. What exactly have been several of the key issues facing most people these past several years?

Do you see the pattern yet. Do you recognize the cause, the reaction, the solution? It is NOT simply a matter of the central banks losing control of the money supply. It is about consolidation of financial and political power.

Once anyone realizes that, they will be better able to cope with the difficulties at hand and work towards regaining their financial footing, and hopefully, eventually, return to being financially independent.

When you are ready to set aside that primer for Economics and start learning how things really work, I will be not only applauding you, but cheering you on. It could theoretically be paid off without inflation, in fact.

It would just take time. If the money creation was halted, for example, the debt could be paid off over a very long period of time in the following manner:. My company is taxed on this sale.

The government takes that tax money and gives it to China, again, etc. Most of this is probably deliberately scattered all over the Internet, and, if one just looks around a bit, people like me can pretend we have connected some dots.

There is, incidentally, nothing in here about the role Switzerland played in the years under scrutiny. The process is perhaps the most astounding piece of sleight of hand that was ever invented.

Banking was conceived in inequity and born in sin … Bankers own the earth. Take it away from them but leave them the power to create money, and, with a flick of a pen, they will create enough money to buy it back again … Take this great power away from them and all great fortunes like mine will disappear, for then this would be a better and happier world to live in … But, if you want to continue to be the slaves of bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, then let bankers continue to create money and control credit.

Since the early goldsmiths discovered fractional reserve banking, created money out of thin air and introduced predatory lending, they have been thrown out of every courntry they set up in, after which those countries returned to resource-based economies and went through several decades of economic recovery.

Until the sixteenth century, in Holland. Holland was, I believe, the site of the first experiment in money market manipulation by this collusion of classes.

The thing is, it was for keeps. This set of conclusions is largely gathered from a monetary history according to James Dale Davidson and William Rees-Mogg: Measuring from crash to crash the dates of the modern credit cycles are as follows: Recent benchmarks are Common Cause: Until people are back to work there is no recovery.

The essence of fiscal control is not race, religion or nationality but just a passion for control over other humans. They were de facto sovereign currency paid back on maturity by the state at a 3.

It took the entire western world including Russia, incidentally, to crush Hitler who had also introduced sovereign money against the web of banking debt. When the directors of the Bank of England asked what was responsible for the booming economy of the young American colonies, Benjamin Franklin explained that the colonial governments issued their own money, which they both lent and spent into the economy: In this manner, creating ourselves our own paper money, we control its purchasing power and we have no interest to pay to no one.

You see, a legitimate government can both spend and lend money into circulation, while banks can only lend significant amounts of their promissory bank notes, for they can neither give away nor spend but a tiny fraction of the money the people need.

The result is that you have always too little credit in circulation to give the workers full employment. You do not have too many workers, you have too little money in circulation, and that which circulates, all bears the endless burden of unpayable debt and usury.

This will set us free: Return to resource-based economies. Gather together and itemize all the resources of your community and learn to barter. Keep your wealth to yourselves. The choice is between two ideals; on the one hand, the ideal of democracy, which represents the rights of free peoples everywhere to govern themselves, and, the ideal of imperialism which seeks to dominate by force and unjust power, an ideal which is by no means dead and which is earnestly [sought] in many quarters still.

This article articulates the money supply methodology using fiat currency fairly well, but it omits the one aspect that all such criticisms do: It is disingenuous to mis-match securities to day zero.

Asking for every dollar loaned over widely varying periods of maturity to be immediately returned is nonsensical. If these data sets for US debt are to be put in their correct perspective, GDP must be summed for the same period at the debt, or its average maturity.

The article is correct in its assumption but the explanation is not complete. To understand perfectly how the system works and why it is inherently unstable go to http: Eliminating the Fed is not going to happen.

JFK tried and look where he ended up. The debt national debt vs. Catch — congress is a bunch of puppets directed by the corporate sponsors donations, donations, donations or otherwise purchased just like in the mall.

Ups i did it again, , , ups, …ongoing. I think i remember reading something about orbital changes and distance that the earth changes — similarly to 4 seasons. Money is not required for repaying debt, so the premise of the article is bunk.

Suppose the debt is to China, for the supply of a billion t-shirts, million microwave ovens, etc. To repay the debt the US has to create a billion t-shirts, million microwave ovens etc plus interest more than it consumes.

Now introduce money into the equation and start from zero cash in the US. The US has assets such as mining rights, so they can sell something to a dollar holder for cash. The cash can be used to repay debt, or it can be invested in productive activities which generate a profit.

The tipping point for a country being or not being able to repay its debt is not related to the money supply. What you need to look at is the relationship between productivity, consumption, assets, debt and interest rates.

Current and future generations of Americans need to a produce more than they consume to make up for the past generations which consumed more than they produced. Or they can b reject the inequitable system and default.

Remember, when a debt is repaid with money it is the debt which disappears, not the money. The money continues to circulate so a penny can pay off an infinite amount of debt.

Wake up FOOL, youve been had! One major flaw in the argument. Your right on how the money supply works and expands, but your forgetting that money is still just pieces of paper floating around.

They really do not have value. Our goods and services are what really has value. How would it be mathematically impossible to pay back our debt with our goods and services when our debt has not yet even reached the dollar amount of all goods and services we produce in 1 year.

Not even one year worth of our goods and services GDP would be needed to pay the debt back. We have had much higher debt in the past comparably. This is if you actually look at our debt compared to GDP.

This is like you would look at your own debt compared to your income in your household. Hi, the founding fathers of the USA also said iirc that the people needed to be educated.

For ppl like me who are not professionally in banking the money issue in full can seem complicated. I think that for sufficient political oversight 1 thing for a new system must be simplicity.

What do you think of this system: Now the money will work as money in exchange. Then a central gov owned bank as the infrastructural backbone, with collective accounts for banks privacy from gov.

By law nobody can resell a loan to a third party. It is my understanding that this third sector has to be dominated by political will of the people, to prevent that sector from growing up those tiranical and corrupt corporations the USA founding fathers may have talked about.

The money would then be spend into circulation and taxed out of it, the government never lends a single coin from anyone only taxes. To round it off: This program also requires the government to be a faithful true democracy … ….

Is this something, if not why? Sorry to post such a long comment. The reason the status quo exists is because of ignorance. If the sheeple were able to peek behind the curtain the revolution would already be upon us.

What we are seeing is the last and greatest betrayal of the American people. Okay people, let me make this simple. Technically, at any moment, they can say — we want our money.

You know HOW we can pay it back though? Obviously not with our money…. But we do have real estate…. Yep, they can collect our collateral… Our precious land. And guess what else? Josh, The money is owed to yourself and other Americans.

Social Security money has been wasted and effectively funded Wall Street Bonuses this year and last year. Same for other liabilities medicare! So, when you portend the money will not be paid back then you are correct.

The only problem is the losers are working Americans. Not the FED or their posse for sure! Fractional banking is a simple system to steal from those who produce value and give to those who control the printing press.

BTW, the legal limit in the UK is fake credit bubble pounds to every actual pound on deposit. At least one bank made it up to 66 to 1 in Fractional banking is a simple way to steal from those who work.

Josh, Its actually worse than you portend. The theft is from each American in the way of Social Security, Medicare, etc. That money has been stolen and is gone.

It is a way for those who do not work to reward themselves and take from others. Imagine if you offered auto insurance to all your friends and neighbors.

What if one had a wreck and asked you to pay? How is this any different than what AIG did? The difference is they control the government and can take from the taxpayers. The same for the FED.

Its a simple con job on trusting Americans. And it has destroyed the USA. The legal limit in the UK is to 1. One banks was leverage 66 to 1 in They are all probably higher now since the derivatives markets are back in the stratosphere.

Do you have any idea what GDP is? Step out of the box and think about it for a minute! Its good for a laugh and a cry. The actual solution is going to be global rebellion against the Elites, denial of validity of all their ownership contracts, their apprehension, and execution.

All assets will be returned. There will probably be some form of globalization, but not run by criminal organizations. I believe there was a president who went against the norm and began printing U.

S Notes — but he was killed soon after. Like the Romans, they promised much more then the state could deliver to their overly vast military and other government run organizations.

Lending permits new companies to exist, you might even say that the west is so well developed because of its lending system….. Thank you Obama, Pelosi, Reid, et al for further adding to the debt by their socialist system of entitlement!!!!!!!

What is the value of real estate owned by the government? What a bunch of crocs we have in Congress. Go Green, Recycle Congress. The federal reserve did not lend us any money. They lent us paper. Pay them back with reams of paper.

If their paper is worth something just because they say it is then so is ours. Stop participating in what the establishment wants us to participate in.

Who do we owe money to? The money is created as a means of exchange and tender. And we all know WHO the money changers are. All this debt… who made profit from it and why???

Lincoln also stood up to them — end of Lincoln. Jackson, being a canny Ulsterman survived many assassination attempts. The House has bankrolled most major wars and profited handsomely therefrom.

Not for all their fortune would I want the blood of one soldier on my hands. The Obama Deception http: The problem that is not addressed here is not money creation, which through fractional reserve banking gives banks the power to create credit from nothing.

The real problem is interest. When the money supply is expanded via fractional reserve banking it creates more money to be injected into the money supply. However loans also charge interest.

Only the money created for the loan contract or principal is actually distributed in the money supply. The money to pay the interest is not created in the money supply, thus creates a system of perpetual inflation.

This is a lose-lose situation for the person taking the loan for not only does the amount of money in the money supply not even exist to pay off the interest, but the original loan that was taken devalues the money we already have.

This means that not only are bankruptcies inevitable, but everyone is taxed subversively via inflation. This is a place where people from all over come in and pitch in their thoughts and opinons about whats happening to our corrupt financial system.

This not to see who is the brightest in financial analysis and to see who is good about historical facts. If you really believe it i will be more than happy to come to your house and relieve you of your excess paper.

The value of anything is the result of supply and demand. The demand for US dollars derives from the laws mandating they be accepted for all debt public and private. The supply results from the government putting money in circulation.

Where supply and demand meet we find the value of something. Paper money has no more or less inherent value than gold or anything else. There value is determined largely by the rules and mores of society.

Money from our laws, and gold from the fact that people like shinny things. I have no problem with the Fed, actually i trust the fed alot more than i trust the current congress, president, and alot of people.

Our problems are big, but not insurmountable. The problem is geting the economy to start growing. And in order to do that we need to create a friendly environment for business. Another tough, but not impossible thing to accomplish.

United States coins and currency including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues.

Foreign gold or silver coins are not legal tender for debts. Unfortunately for The Fed they screwed up when they passed The Federal Reserve Act and failed to void the ability of Treasury to issue its own non-debt-bearing currency which is also legal tender.

It requires only an executive order to implement. The mounting debts are deliberate and are but a tool to take this country from the American citizens. Furthermore, this discussion ignores the effect of crude oil on banking and money.

A comprehensive discussion includes the effect of the petrodollar system on our currency. With that, we should include the impact of holding more crude oil within our borders than all the other proven oil reserves on earth.

Here are the official estimates: It contains over billion barrels of oil. On August 8, President Bush mandated its extraction. In four years of high oil prices none has been extracted and nearly all of us are unaware of its existence.

These oil assets are coveted by the international banking cabal and the largest multinational industries because in a world reliant on crude oil, oil can be used as currency between nations.

The size of ours guarantee global predominance. Currently the major multinational banks are colluding to take this wealth from the American citizens. They are in the process of creating a spectacular economic collapse of our fiat dollar system.

With it will come a tremendous drop in our standard of living. It means increased infant mortality rates and decreased life expectancy. Afterwards we will surrender our constitutional government and our natural resources for the promise of regaining some modicum of our standard of living and relative affluence.

All the while we would possess the means and the resources to pay the debts they incurred for us, enormous though they may be. Sad to say it, ladies and gentlemen, but control of our government has been taken from us and now we begin to pay the price for letting it happen.

That is why it is called legal tender because the idea of paper money is simply made up and works just as IOUs of sort. When US used to have the gold standard - US currency was backed up by the gold bullion, which had value.

Or, research what they were up to in with the creation of Credit Default Swaps and the repeal of Glass-Steagall Act of in Congress and the Treasury are both in the back pocket of the fed.

And Goldman Sachs is their favorite recruiting grounds. Your article does not take into account that the nation was actually much more in debt during World War II. Immediately stop all payroll taxes into the system right now.

Do a very slow drain back to those people who paid in their entire lives with an apology that the government will never do that again, ever, under threat of individual sate secession. Let people keep what they earn.

Hold a Con Convention with an agenda that Congress must always balance its budget every year with third party audits held up by private sector and publicized with fact checks made available for all to see.

Medicare can be reformed by ending the entitlement for those paying in now. Bring competition back into the system by letting providers compete across state lines. Handicap trial lawyers and ambulance chasers by introducing a large tax on any judgment issued by a court against businesses.

Because businesses are our bread and butter, literally our very survival. We need to become grateful again for businesses who provide jobs rather than stigmatize them as greedy organizations.

Therefore they get special rights as risk takers. Time for them to legalize marijuana. That move alone would save them millions. Then, they take it over. Grow it, sell it, tax it.

However, the Federal reserve turns over all its profits back to the treasury. So there really is no interest being paid to the Fed. Who is the government going into debt with? Money, itself paper, gold, feathers whatever is simply bizarre.

How can anyne in their right mind have faith in our Congress, the Democrats or the person in Washington. Get Real you are correct. However consider the fate of the last president to issue United States Notes rather than relying on Federal Reserve Notes.

None other than President John F. He saw this coming when there was hardly a sign of it anywhere, and now it is here. Here is why your logic is faulty. And nobody is proposing that anyway;.

Money gets recycled, like air. Without prosecution s for this crime it will be difficult for the other suggestions — many good — to take place. My suggestion then is pray to God for his mercy on our Country.

This is our most powerful weapon. Declare the US as Bankrupt and not pay off the debt… Alternativly… 1. Refuse monetary policy to get as screwed up as it has been.. Stop a trade debt… so money can come in from other countries and hence pay the debt… Why do you think Barak Obama just recently asked china to buy product from them?

Take up taxes and stop voting in politicians that claim they can solve the problem without bringing it up… More is in a movie IOUSA which is alittle better than my descriptions above…. Bystander, the point regarding value of the USD is that is comes out of nothing.

Certain people can press a few computer buttons and create hundreds of billions of dollars. If one person has the power to create hundreds of billions of dollars out of thin air, then what can the true value be?

The value, the true value, is nonexistent. People value dollars because of faith and trust in the government which says they have value. The same government that prints the money out of thin air.

The difference with gold as money, the reason why the founders of the United States mandated that only gold and silver were money, is that gold or silver cannot be created out of nothing by government bureaucrats.

When governments are unable to create money out of thin air then they have no choice but to live within their means. But, governments living within their means equates to less interest income for the bankers….

Another point about gold, it has an extremely long and successful track record as being accepted as money, for more than 5, years. All fiat currencies, of which the USD is, in the history of the world aside from our current group of fiat currencies have failed.

Fiat has a very bad historical track record. OK, why not for some famous US solutions: Just manipulate the gold and silver price upward instead of downward. Your advantage with only a few telephone calls to some Wall Street Banks: History has learned to be very cynical to believe the US will have the balls to confront their problems.

Most probably they will find an easy way out: It appears to me the crisis was caused by the US, that is the Federal Reserve. What happened was that the risks were sold abroad as derivatives, so foreign banks have to suffer as well as US banks.

Actually, we are in the same boat, all over the world. We need some bright ideas and political clout to get rid of this debt in the best way for the people. We know that debt is as fictional as money created by the banks, so something must be possible in this area.

Therein lies the rub. Money is illusory and does not actually exist. It is a debt instrument. Perception is truly reality. The problem is that folks are beginning to figure this out.

Like China and the Middle East. Abolish the voracious middle man-Federal Reserve. Print our own currency. Stop making mortgage payments. If you are self employed stop paying your quarterly income taxes.

Of course nobody will do this because they are scared to lose their littole possessions. But if we did the country would grind to a halt pretty soon. Then see where the chips fall.

That, or we go back to seashells. First, as Get Real pointed out the Federal Reserve and its fiat note are unconstitutional. Only congress has the power to coin money.

Paper bills were created to facilitate large transactions, but the bills were tied to gold redeemable at a quantity of grams of gold. The fact is, our Federal reserve not is not redeemable for anything.

Nixon cut that tie. So, our money has ties only to Federal reserve assets, which consist of failed mortgage securities, to the tune of 2 trillion. Bystander has drank the kool-aid and I am going to increase your choco rations to 30grams next week!

The Fedreral reserve issues currency, not the government. Gold and silver have been used as money for thousands of years, so their established value is not in question whatsoever as a money.

DO the smart thing and diversify some of your investments into precious metals and get in to dividend paying foreign stocks that have little to no ties to US interests.

A complete waste of time. This quantitative easing was necessary due to interest rate considerations, not because there was not enough money. Simply put, if the US Treasury had to issue a Trillion or so more in US Treasury Notes overnight, the interest rates would have sky-rocketed which would have put the chances for a recovery into the remote range.

Moreover, the author implies that the FED is controlled a group of elites that and are absconding the money they make. This is only remotely true. If that was not the case, you can be certain the Bernanke would not be re-appointed as FED Chairman by a vote of Congress.

Secondly, the majority of our money is created when banks make loans. When a bank makes a new loan it is debit on its books and the credit is a deposit into the borrowers account. Somebody has to clarify to me how money has been lost in this transaction.

Thirdly, the money supply is tight right now because banks have been contracting their balance sheets. This is being done by tightening credit standards. When less credit is being issued by banks a contraction in the macro money supply occurs.

Likewise, when banks make loans, their balance sheets are made larger on both the asset and liability side deposits or money of their books and the macro money supply is expanded.

Fourthly, part of the reason that the macro money supply is not expanding is due to loans losses that banks are taking due to the lack of supervision regarding the subprime debacle.

When banks lose money, they very naturally become hesitant to make news loans that could result in further losses. A natural contraction occurs. That is what the FED is trying to partially offset by expanding its balance sheet, so the whole system does not implode.

When the US imports more goods and services than it exports, the difference is made up by selling them our debt. Again, all the money created via the fractional monetary system has a debit and a credit… they equal.

However, when foreigners end up owning our money because we traded it for goods and services, we do end up with less domestic money than we have debt. And, if that money does not eventually come back to the US in the form of trade surpluses we will not have enough money to pay our domestic debt with.

However, the money did not somehow disappear. The debits still equal the credits. The problem is the foreigners have become our creditor and we are the debtors.

Sixthly, debt based monetary systems are inherently dependent upon the money continuing to circulate. When people become scared and start hording money instead of keeping a healthy amount of it in circulation, there will be a lack of money to service debt.

It is not unwise to save money, but when the macro savings rate is high enough to result in a contraction of economic activity, we will have a debt servicing issue.

It may be legal tender. So what two things are legal money under the constitution of the USA? What is needed is a return to a Consttutionally based monetary system.

End the Federal Reserve, repudiate all debts to the banksters and sieze the assets of the financial oligarchy as reperation for the deception. As for foriegn goverments, send the spineless politicians as payment.

So the US govt owes the Federal Reserve? Who says the US govt has to pay the owners of the Fed reserve? What army do they have? Every fianical consultanr and economist should be asked if the have read.

This whole situation is retarded. With all of their factories and land we can pay off our debt way faster. So why do we not do that? Is there any real practical problem with that, or is it just an ideological issue?

Just look at how much trouble they are having just trying to get an audit of the Federal Reserve right now…. The only solution is to go back to the gold standard. That way if we need to pay back our debts, we can use the gold or whatever assets the standard is based off to pay back that debt.

So, the question that puzzles me is — why China is giving us the money instead giving it to its own people whose living standard is way lower then ours? What gold is is a store of value. While there is some fluctuation in true value due to the occurrence of a depleted vein of ore, the most common reason that the price goes up or down in any given period is due to the strength or weakness of the paper currency used to buy it.

I bought a certain number of gold American Eagles 1 oz. The spot price for 1 oz. If the economy crashes and your beloved Federal Reserve Note becomes as worthless as a German Deutchmark between the years, you will see the folly of keeping your wealth in paper dollars!

Value based on a metal that requires labor and investment in order to be extracted out of the ground? And has been prized as true wealth since before Biblical times? Or value based on printed paper.

Something that a private group of elite bankers manipulate the value of? As say general De Gaulle, about the end of Bretton Wood sistem, now we have a painted paper to govern the world….

It is clear that the first step is to stop any additional debt. The boat is almost full of water, stop the increase so a plan can be made to reduce what is already in.

As people can not find jobs and have time on their hands bartering will become more common, they will trade work or items for things of survival. Am I missing something here? If you think fiat currency is as good as gold, I refer you to recent events in Zimbabwe and Argentina.

At the time that document was penned, our dollars were in fact backed by gold. Since abandoning the gold standard, foreign governments have little reason to hold the FRN in reserve. That is the nature of debt: Even on the gold standard that was true.

The government can still issue money in the form of coins. Maybe we should all pay for things with a lot of loose change! No-one has answered my question above. You seem very knowledgeable.

Would you like to answer my question please? If it does solve this problem, so why do we not do that? There is no way to fix it now and no way out. The best solution is to hunker down, let it all burn down around you as social disorder asserts itself, and try to come out alive.

JFK has already signed an Executive Order for the issue of debt free Treasury Notes and the Notes were printed and ready to go into circulation when he was killed.

His Executive Order is still legally in effect but no one has had the courage since then to implement it. Immediately after they killed him, and he was not the 1st President to be killed for this reason, the newly printed Treasury Notes were destroyed.

The President we now have like many before him are owned by the owners of the Federal Reserve House of Rothschild or their agents George Soros etc. If these people finally get kicked out of our country and the chance is slim because the American People will probably never understand or care about the financial system since these very same people control our minds using many methods but mainly through television, they will probably remotely militarily destroy what little remains of our economy, society, and country that they were not able to destroy while here.

They will destroy it out of vengeance and desperation because it is their nature to destroy. They hate the U. Still though, I believe that forgiving them for destroying us physically is the right thing to do.

It seems like that day is quickly approaching for most of us. Why do all of the JFK documentaries present every possibility of who did it to confuse but none ever mention this one fact? If you just gave people what they needed from what you were producing, and they just gave to you as needed from what they produced, things would be a lot easier.

If you understand there is no real need for money, then it shouldnt be a big stretch to see that people would be happier if they only took what was necessary, and then only more than that as long as it didnt deprive others.

Does shutting down down the Federal Reserve and restoring the power to issue U. Congress solve this problem, if so why do we not do that? In theory, central banks are independent bodies, such as in Norway, Australia etc.

In practice in the USA, the power of the Federal Reserve to issue currency is already in the hands of Congress, via the majority of the incumbent party and therefore, the President. Issuance of currency theoretically dilutes the value of extant currency, but as there are other world currencies traded and the US being the reserve currency, this distorts its value internationally.

Domestically the picture is somewhat different. What we are seeing now in the domestic US economy is debt deflation. In the next few years, the US debt may likely be eroded due to increasing price inflation.

In other words, inflation will reduce the debt over time, in the same way that fixed mortgage payments of 15 years ago are less a hit to your wallet today than they were in If the USA can improve its international competitiveness by selling more to ther countries than it buys, it will have the income to reduce its debt over time.

The big question is, can it do this? The emerging markets are there, in India and China. But costs of production, mostly labour costs are too high. The US will simply have to reduce its standard of living paying its workers much less to viably produce the goods that other countries want to buy.

I hope this answer helps. If you are serious about a solution, there is one from ancient times that did quite well. Declare a year of jubilee every 50 or so years. I guess that his bank held a shotgun to his head and forced him to take the mortgage.

One can outlaw fractional reserve banking. It would be much harder to get a loan or a credit card and interest rates would be much higher. An there would be much higher fees for checking accounts.

The recent financial crisis would still have occurred even if fractional reserve banking were outlawed, since the main problem occurred in non-banking institutions such as AIG.

Brophanity That is the idea… i might have stretched the explanation too much, but that is exactly what i had i mind…. David Smith just explained this to you, but there were few more posts about it before as well.

I agree with the first part of your post, but I think the second part is not true. The government itself was not intended to be religious itself. The sooner the US Government defaults on its debt the sooner democracy can start recovering from being pimped out by left wing inclinations inherent in all people.

I hope the whole thing blows up, and the economy tanks. I am so tired of scrapping for every dollar I can earn, while people who cheat the system are rewarded. California and the entire U.

Maybe it would be more productive to hold a seance with a crystal ball and govern like that. Why would we need money on this planet anyway? We all should work for the benefit of the whole planet!

You know, I was thinking — we could really shorten this great idea of yours into something simple and catchy!! Let me make myself perfectly clear. Like my namesake, I have one basic catch-all creed: Millions of my ancestors died to pass on a legacy of Liberty to me, my children, their children and so on.

For the first time in the history of our race on our planet, a Government was instituted which gave the people power over their Government. We are your neighbors, your police, your soldiers, sailors and airmen.

To shut our mouths and get busy preparing for what may likely MUST come. If you think our reaction to the Japanese was something, just wait until you finally force us to take back our Republic. But why would we wish to retire all the outstanding debt in the economy?

Loans and bonds have a variety of maturities and only the most remarkable synchronicity would have them all, or any appreciable portion of them, come due at once.

Remarkably, the Austrians conceded to Montagne his third premise. He quotes a Ron Paul supporter: Paul has given these kids no guidance, only bumper sticker slogans. Weimarer Republik, ca Starts printing huge amounts of notes to do just what you propose.

Hyperinflation, destabilising government and a complete collapse of the economy. This all stopped only when they released a completely new currency, hard-backed and stable enough to earn trust.

That centralist communist state with no independent central bank? Those guys who printed money when they needed it? Fat lot of good it did them. This was only stopped when Jeltsin did a shock-introduction of a completely new currency.

Zimbabwe, circa last year after an inflation of Of course in all these cases the money printing was far from the only cause. But in all cases it ended really really disastrously.

Two government collapses and a world war disastrously. I call it the Compound Interest Paradox. This is a very confusing subject. The details of the monetary system were made complicated on purpose, by the banksters, to cover up their crimes.

Summarizing, new money is only created when someone borrows. However, only the principal is created and not the interest payments. The result is that society as a whole is in a deeper and deeper debt hole.

In order to prevent the scam from collapsing, you need every-increasing inflation. The banksters profit by printing and spending new money. All taxation is theft. The inflation tax is an evil tax, because it steals your savings and accumulated labor.

Economic power is concentrated in the hands of the banksters, who print and spend new money. Government is one big extortion racket. The USA has an unfair monetary system. Most aspects of the U.

Constitution are based on principles that are found in the Bible like righteousness and justice. What I meant to write is completely different: S because we have been a Christian Society.

Maybe inadvertently I was correct…. A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

The Federal Reserve has to take a pay cut and lessen their tight grip on the reigns. Unfortunately, the slavery continues. Until they can tighten the reigns again. The solution is always education.

The basis for this article is propaganda and ignorance. The most obvious solution was not even mentioned: Sell Alaska to China and make sure Palin is there while it happens.

You could go to the bank and trade your notes in for the gold, but then that got squandered away, so after some shifty legislation and then a makeover on the dollar bill, no one ever speaks of it anymore….

What happens if the debt keeps increasing and eventually just goes so far out that whatever is done, it just cannot be repayed? Patrick Henry, what are you on about? When it comes time to payback you wanna talk tough?

I presume you thought all the money you got was free money, right? Get an education, pal! The Fed was the brainchild of Paul M. You say The truth is that we have to rely on what the Federal Reserve tells us, because they have never been subjected to a comprehensive audit by the U.

For more, check this out…. Just reading these comments shows me how bad of an idea it would be to allow the public to have any say in the control of money. Tragically, we are just now worrying about our housing burning down, but only AFTER we have thoroughly doused it with gasoline and tossed a torch on it.

Whatever the High and Noble intents of the US Government to get into debt, everything must have limits, as the debt was reasonably under control until US has over stretched its capability.

Like a elastic band, the economy can be stretched, but even that has a limit and that limit has been reached. You have to attack on all fronts, not just one. Get to the root, otherwise its a perpetual waste of time.

For those who want to know more about how the Federal Reserve has been created and why we need to get rid of it: Read the Creature from Jekyll Island Or, listen to this 1 hour audio lecture by the author.

Also, congress is controlled by the Fed since they give them plenty of money for the election. I have been improving the place all these years in order to prepare for the hard times coming.

The other day a neighbor stopped by to talk about food storage and we discussed that we and our other neighbors will need to stick together to help each other. Most of these neighbors are very poor but we all have skills that are useful to each other.

We are going to have to help each other to survive the coming problems we have created in our economy. Some are starting to wake up to what might be coming our way!

That is good news if enough wake up in time. I agree with T, there are no American people anymore. I live in Nashville Tennessee and literally everywhere I go it seems everyone around me does not speak english and are wearing burkas on their heads.

I have been here my whole life but sadly now I feel like I am the minority in my own city. And people wonder why America is in the shape it is in. The illegals are draining us of all our resources.

If we went to their countries and did the same thing, they would throw us out on our asses. America will continue to spiral downward as long as we allow all the illegal deadbeat leeches to come in and take over and steal from us what we and our ancestors have worked our whole lives to obtain.

Is what is happening all over Europe and Mexico finally spilling into the streets of America? If we do not catch this in the bud we may not be able to catch this problem at all into the future.

I have seen incidents personally that I would not want any American citizen to have to face. These things are not pranks, they are very serious crimes. They are happening in front or Americans eyes on a daily basis and getting worse.

It has to tell us something is going very wrong and we have to fight it now. When I was 10 years old I could walk the streets without a fear. Today you have to fear to walk anywhere especially at night.

Is this a way to have to live? An aging gracefully citizen. No pledge of allegiance, no ten commandments, Etc. We can blame ourselves, the American people, for not standing up and allowing the Govt to have done so.

Can we fix this? Vote all the bums out and make sure we put people into office who will stand by our God and our constitution. Oh, I wonder how these gangs would respond if they were confronted with armed citizens prepared to defend themselves.

The finished work of the socialist dream. Look at the big picture also. Several years ago I came to the conclusion that we are in the first century of a middle age period. All of the empires and colonial powers have disappeared since except for three — US, India and China.

Governments are decentralizing all over. The US government is experiencing political seizures, and has begun to pass and enforce laws which are anti-democratic and arbitrary. Immigration has been accelerating since as more people from more places seek safety.

World finance is being destroyed by inflation in all countries 4. Inflation is destroying the access to higher education by the middle class. The gap between the wealthy and the middle class is widening as the banksters and others steal more and more from both shareholders and taxpayers.

Food is becoming more expensive and therefore beyond the means of many people. Government spending is totally out of control and becoming increasingly capricious. The Federal government is subsidizing corn production for ethanol production an extremely inefficient process which takes land out of food production.

Unemployment worldwide is increasing at an alarming rate, which means that many more poor families are being created. Business is trying to hide monetary inflation by providing products in smaller quantities the ounce quart and ounce half gallon and lower quality.

For more information on middle age periods, read 1. Michael Grant — The Climax of Rome esp. An account of the first middle age period B. Morris Bishop — The Middle Ages.

The second middle age period A. Things do not have to go this far if people will take charge and demand constructive change. We have something that earlier ages did not possess. But never in the history of the world have we had horribly wicked International Bankers that are ruling our planet.

And their wickedness will have you enslaved and going to hell in no time. For they are serving Lucifer; and he has taught them how to rob and steal great wealth to enslave the whole world. And now; they are planning to put their mark of the beast chip in everybodies forehead or hand; so you will become their brainless zombie slave.

Because Revelation 13 and 14 talks about this. But those of us who will reject and resist this chip, will be martyred and killed. While horrific, none of the examples given are anything new, other than the ready access to things not previously brought to light cell-phone cameras and the internet have provided us.

You have a screw loose. I bet you are from California…. I live in a rural area of the Midwest. In my area we have been able to sleep well enough and always known our neighbors — up until a few months ago I did not lock my cars or my home most of the time — there was no need.

That has changed, neighbors are now siphoning gas out of cars from desperation, and stealing scrap lumber, metal, livestock, produce and anything else they can get their hands on to sell or eat.

Over the last year or so the police departments of some areas have started taking these seriously and actually investigated and caught a few. They are sometimes groups of people working together to amass resources to sell.

We now keep a vigilant eye on our little flock of chickens and we have a colony of rabbits as well. We keep any resources away from the road on the back side of our property — we also keep two German Shepherd Dogs for guarding our property.

Living in the country is NOT what it used to be. Even here, though the violence is not as prevalent yet, life has certainly changed for the worse. I believe it will get much worse — thank God we are an armed and capable household.

It is sad, but necessary. In America our idyllic country living is not what it used to be and may never be again. I rarely comment but was thinking last night I need to post up a kudo as I check and read your site every day.

A big thank you to you and everyone else that visits the site on a regular basis. It is appreciated more than you know. I cannot urge everyone enough — start storing food.

If you think it is bad now, just wait to see what happens if the teabaggers and other radical groups are successful in cutting off welfare payments. Oh, let me clarify. Do radicals really think these people are going to politely move to the streets with there families and be content with eating out of garbage cans?

That this is now considered to be radical is really the crux of the problem. Since when do Americans stand around waiting to be fed? Did the pilgrims do that? The problem is everyone sitting around complaining that nobody is helping them or doing anything FOR them.

This is what happens when you throw out God. Historically very poor societies have been civilized places. Material poverty is not the problem— spiritual poverty is. We should all start going back to church.

Well first of all those things have been happening in. Chicago for a long time honestly how long do u expect people to work for pebbles while the people there working for are making billions off of them?

Second how long can u tell someone to do as I say not as I do, before they say f that if u can do it so can I? Only ONE thing is needed to restore and maintain law and order in this country: Otherwise, face the consequences of street rule by human-animals.

Only a legally permissable billy-club — or more — up side the head is the way to prevent or stop that kind of barbaric behavior. My husband and I have spent the last 4 years prepping and educating ourselves on what can and WILL be coming down the pike and trying very hard to prepare ourselves for it.

Meanwhile, we live in an area where most folks are more concerned about redecorating their homes, buying new cars, taking their 11 year olds to Lady GaGa concerts, shopping, etc. I felt like I was having an out of body experience.

I seriously cannot relate to these people anymore. I stopped trying to talk to people about the economy…. Sorry for the rant…. I live in Atlanta Georgia. Everyday there are signs.

Babysitter kills toddler, 2 shot outside teen party, Brick thrown from I overpass and several more. I forgot to add this. The something that earlier ages did not have is perspective and knowledge of history.

Things were much different than they are now. I think that was the begining of what we see now. I have moved to a remote spot, started a garden, gotten a 2 year supply of food and am armed, a shotgun with 00 buck and handguns.

When things get bad it will not be possible to go out of the house. One should have basic necessities to keep one alive until the worst is over. In the end only those who have hearts and faith in God Almighty will be left, if He so wills it.

I agree the possibility of an economic collapse is real but I think these are only circumstantial points. I grew up hearing about craziness like this all the time. I do agree things are getting more out of control and will research the statistics of how much worse things are.

I am sure I will find that crime has accelerated dramatically when broken down into numbers. We have to get back to shared values, as embodied in the Constitution: Sure free trade has significantly dropped the price of goods but at what cost?

Yes, it is spreading everywhere. The tsunami if immigration legal and illegal since combined with the worship of diversity which dicourages cultural assimilation of immigrants, has destroyed the cohesion of our society.

Hyphenated Americanism has caused our nation to become the polyglot boarding house Theodore Roosevelt warned against. I agree that things are falling apart very quickly in this country.

I also agree with you, Michael, that at the root of all of it is the moral decline of the people in this country, and the complete and utter selfishness of people that goes along with it. I am blessed enough to live in a city that is unusually wealthy compared to the rest of the country.

I am, however, still seeing many signs of the economic crisis, and the collapse of society in general. I know it is only going to get much worse in the next few years. These are people who have excellent resumes, experience, and skills.

They are becoming very frustrated. Seeing this makes me feel very grateful that both me and my husband still have good jobs that we enjoy. This is in a city that used to make the list in top places to live in the U.

My husband and I have our first baby on the way, due this summer. It is hard to put into words the heaviness and sadness I feel thinking about how different her childhood will be from what mine was.

I absolutely know things are going to get much worse, and it will not be easy. I am trying to do my best to prepare spiritually, emotionally, and physically. I think the most important thing will be to trust God, and be prepared to live through a period of extreme turbulence and difficulty without turning away from what is moral and right.

The only way out of this is to get the crooks in Washington D. We need to set an example for them and instill real values in their lives. The crooks that are running this once wonderful country into the ground need to be made into an example as well, they need to be taught that they work for us, the citizens of the UNITED States of America.

OK, I see this is long term, but if we start on this path, we will get to our destination. In the meantime, urge all who will listen to buy American and try to consume a little less from overseas manufacturers, esp.

China who will not let their currency float on the exchanges, thereby making the fiscal playing field so unfair. God Bless you and Protect you on your mission. I am a licensed clinical social worker by profession.

In my daily clinical work there is an increase in mental health issues, the collapse of families, an increase in domestic violence against women and children, a rise in pedophilia and sex crimes, the youth desensitization towards violence and personal accountability, and a general indifference of society towards the welfare of others.

What is particularly troubling is the Washington lawmakers are even more corrupt now than in the early 90s when I was a Capital Hill staffer on the U. Senate Select Committee on Ethics.

The psychology, psychiatric, and licensed clinical social work research studies indicate that when unemployment is high and the economy is poor there is an increase in violence, crime, and poor mental health.

I fear this is only the tip of the iceberg. What is your advice regarding the economic collapse of America? Something no one has mentioned is that the Chinese own us because they hold our debt. Eventually they will appear on our shores and take what they want.

We still need a strong military for this very reason. I would like to hear your thoughts. Talk about the law of unintended consequences. I live in Orange County, CA. And here in CA. THAT costs 3x the national average.

Times, say, 15 million. They sneak back a second time, another brand. Perhaps the most embarrassing should be the invasion of Grenada. What harm could they ever do to us.

Also our government totally missed the point with communism. It was a parasitic economy which was using up all its wealth for military development while forcing its people to live in abject poverty and virtual slavery.

Now the US has also become a parasitic nation destroying the working class to enrich the already super-rich parasites, who finance our elections so that our only choice is picking a candidate which is still going to make them still richer while continuing to impoverish the working class.

The gap between rich and working class has been widening for decades. So what is now the difference between them and us? It is a true and sad fact that Americans the youth in particular have lost their way and the we can only hope and pray for them.

We also need to be an example and provide guidance whenever we have the opportunity. God Save America and her people. Everyone wants to know what the meaning of life is. That concept has been taken from our society and we are witnessing the result.

Those who shine at living life actually take action to correct that which is wrong. Obama and Ghandi both now that the deadliest form of violence is poverty! The big difference is that Obama welcomes it and Ghandi tried to lead people to escape from it.

The evidence is in-there is a super massive black hole in the center of our galaxy and even a bigger one in DC. And I do think theres a reason why we are still pretty much at peace here.

Something that got lost in the cities of America, where populations are so large, passersby are hardly recognized as fellow human beings. I am not entirely sure that the roots for this upcoming social catastrophe reside in economic conditions alone.

For decades, the moral fiber of the world has been deliberately corrupted. The psychopathic Rothschilds have worked very us on convincing us all that we are as vile and murderous and greedy as they are.

We read about the senseless killing of Arabs, with excuses intended only to thinly disguise the true reasons: We suspect our government killed Pat Tillman and MLK, and they have conditioned us to accept such horrors as if life without principle is indeed worth living.

They have worked hard, very hard, on corrupting us, and they have succeeded, at least when it comes to most Americans. I hope, that then in America more cities should be razed and more civilizations be drawn closer.

That will probably declare landlocked nations for native americans. The power of Fed is gone, so are the enforcement of reservations treaties, the indians will roam around San Francisco and Newyork herding their cattle, farming corn and wildoats in Austin, Denver and Tulsa.

The agreement of reservation life is over. I did not expect that America would be independent in, expand by Louisiana purchase, grab massive territory which displaced my tribal affiliates in greater Mexico, later declare American empire, massacre of Lakota Sioux.

What a powerful America it was! Now it shall be a junk if 17 states not withdraw from 32 other. I see an advocate on my country farm and calling me buy more land, a blue-white winged bird.

Its Sheba here… Where the King of Kings lives. America will be beautiful and wealthy if you divide into two Federations, East and West. Almost all of these examples are overblown and isolated incidents.

You sir are a retard. I live in Fargo, ND and we have been having a rash of crime lately. In the past 6 months we have had multiple gas station robberies, bank robberies, and the latest, a shooting at one of our three movie theaters.

I am no racist but when you cobble together all these nationalities into one area, Bosnians, Somalis, Mexicans, Whites, etc. When I was a kid these types of things never happened.

I sort of feel pretty good about living at the top right corner of the country, since life here is not so hectic. So, all that you have posted above is possible here in Maine, but as of yet, we nothing like that happening here at the moment.

Kind of a chickenshit thing to say. What you really mean is that that the character of the welfare scumbags and urban morons will come out. These are not our countrymen, and not Americans.

What many good Americans will see, however, is the telescopic image of the losers heads in their rifle scopes. Time to man up. If you or your family are threatened by any kind of these criminal idiots, kill them.

Do the world a favor. Self defense is not a crime. If you live in any of the urban centers of the USA and you are not armed then you are part of the problem.

Show me a jury that will convict someone who is defending themselves or their family or other innocent people. Better yet, get out of the cesspools that cities have become and start living like human beings again.

Time to choose sides. Which will you be on? All of this observant commentary about young people in America beginning to act like third world savages is alarmingly true. In some areas of the country, the age old teenage rebellious tradition of selling weed is no longer profitable as the average consumer dollar shrinks.

Having millions of broke, jobless, directionless, shiftless kids around from the suburbs to the inner city is not the recipe for a civil society. This extreme neglect and economic deprivation of young people, particularly young minorities, is turing them into animals.

About a month ago I was robbed in broad daylight walking to the store on a picture perfect 75 degree sunny day at 1 PM by two high school dropout teenagers on the path in my nice suburban town which is located in third richest county in America!

A few months before that I was beaten unconscious by random drunk young people on the path near my home that I woke up in the hospital getting stitches in my face. This will be one dangerous summer for places all across America.

Latin America has been plundered by the USA, what you are seeing now and your own politicians stealing and doing all of you idiots, as they always have with us hope you feel on the skin which here in latin america feel in relation to its political, would you read a good bit of history, Americans and Mexicans are different only in the culture and language, all other things are equal to you, American patriotism and a way to fool the people to do what obama bush and company limited are sending their children to die, that has nothing of patriotism, rinse your mouth before talking to us.

USA open your mind now the rulers are undermining their own nation. Gabriel, I will be the first to admit we have corrupt leaders over the US, but so does Mexico. How can you say the US has plundered Latin America when immigrants pour over the border illegally and use up US resources such as education and health care?

Are they paying taxes to the US for these benefits? The US is being plundered by the self-entitled people of Mexico who believe not in US law, but break it daily. Just prepare yourself spiritually because material possessions, or the thought of losing them, will only worry you sick.

And remember, things must get worse before they can get better. Or so we hope. You are so right. Material things will become bait, the attractant leading to these thugs wanting to come into your home and assault you as society breaks down.

The History Channel has a good survival program, usually ran with the nuclear apocalypse in D. Civilization is a thin veneer over our more savage nature. And civilization is a luxury of wealth.

The inevitable reduction in the American standard of living, especially that of the poorest classes, will strip away much of this facade. Poverty, relative as it is, has produced numerous groups who have little investment in the status quo, and little to lose other than social restraint.

Revolution, viewed as an anarchic breakdown of order, is the belief of those with more at stake in the current social structures. Look at Japan, did they have epidemic murder, looting and rap as in New Orleane?

Was there widspread looting in Moscow during the power shortages? I live in San Mateo County, CA and there are more and more reports of robberies, vandalism and violence going on every week. San Jose, CA is seeing a huge rise in homicides as well.

Thank you for saying that. A lot of hard work goes into all of this and it is encouraging to hear that all of the hard work is appreciated. Being born in to parents who were teachers, I grew up wrong.

Marrying my wife saved me, and having children pulled me hard right. Even then, I ignored politics except for the 2nd admendment. I only took the kids to church every now and again. I selfishly left the big city I grew up in to live in a small town in the heartland for my childrens sake.

My selfishness has destroyed this country. I should have been a better Christian, and held public officials to better morals and higher standards. When that failed, I should have ran myself for office, or given more of my time and support money to officials who had the proper respect for life and liberty.

I am approaching a time, were I can do this, but the hour I fear is to late. Had me, as a Christian done more, it could have been a better world. I cry for my children, and thank God he at least gave me the sense to get out of high population densities.

Funny, when I was 8ish I was scared that I would die in nuclear war with Russia, when I was 17ish, learning how to write pascal in highschool, i thought I would be able to visit the moon around the year I apologize for my inactions and misspellings.

May God bless this Once Great Nation again. I tend to think this is what happens to a society that goes to long without troubles or tribulations as a whole. It is like a relationship the strongest ones are the tried and tested ones.

Most like myself only socialize with a select few and up until a few weeks ago I had no idea even who my neighbors were. I assumed like myself they preferred to be left alone. I was surprised to find they were more than happy to make my acquaintance as I was theirs.

Makka you have made the first step, you have found and admitted your mistake. The next step is change. How do you get from where you are to where you want to be? That has also been my situation. Do you know your neighbors?

Do you have storage of dry goods, alternate power, protection? You have to start really where you live Makka. We know whats coming and its only to late if you give up. You were sorry for your inaction well there is no better time then now for being proactive.

Get out there meet the people around you form a block watch or group. Learn to get back to basics and survival skills. Someone may need you. When cash welfare stops.

The cities, all of them will become violent to the extream. Hungry people will do anything to get food. Cash welfare is paid out of workers taxes. Food stamps are paid for by taxes. Section 8 housing vouchers are paid out of taxes.

WIC is paid for out of taxes. When these and many other giveaway programs are forced to be abandoned then real trouble will start. I left my home in Texas 10 years ago to study physics in Germany.

I had been looking forward to coming home after finishing my doctorate next year, but now do not see how that will be possible. My family still seems mostly oblivious to the new country developing around them but from here the situation looks dire.

As a physicist, I will have to live and work in a city — are there any safe cities left in the US? I got my PhD in the US, and had to flee to a foreign nation. America is collapsing more so now that money is being printed to purchase government debt.

Academia in the US is in its last legs, at least in my field Mathematics. I try teaching in an elite private college for a while, but found myself teaching courses like differential equations to people who could not even add fractions and who were majoring in engineering and lacked reasoning skills… The chair explained to me that unless I gave students grades of C or above, the school would lose money because many of those students would transfer.

So I had to alter my standards. Civilization is breaking down, that is a fact. Although economic collapse will serve as a catalyst. A moral person will continue to be a moral person whether they are rich or poor.

We have become a nation without principles. The moral fabric of the nation has become ripped. People from all sorts of economic strata are losing their moral compasses as things implode.

The Lord will not prosper this people if they continue to violate his commandments. However, that is but one thorn on a rose stem. Without giving over your life to God and His path, you will never approach that glorious rose at the top!

There will be many thorns to spear your side, but as long as you keep climbing beyond them, the Rose will be reached and a New World will open to you.

Until Society reaches the absolute bottom and starts to rebound on a more positive note, you will need all the items listed to get you through. Most importantly will be prayer, alone, and with others as worship.

Everything about our country is in decline. Moral collapse is just a part of it. I hate guns but for the first time a couple years ago I finally looked into buying a weapon for our home.

The media kept talking about how more people are buying guns because Obama got elected and gun afficionados were afraid of him outlawing their guns. What are these people going to do when the dam really breaks?

I highly recommend you purchase a fire arm for protection. If you do, and have no experience with a gun, you need to get training on the safe operation of a gun.

Many people I know are buying guns and a decent supply of ammo, many people are waking up to whats happening to this country. God help us all. What makes you think the bad guys will tell you when they buy guns?

Husbands, fathers, brothers, or who ever has any knowledge about guns — teach your family members how to safely use one and the precautions that go along with guns. If you have no knowledge of guns, find a friend or family member who does.

Learn how to handle one and teach your loved ones to do the same. I have always hated guns, but my spouse took me out to shoot and learn how to handle a gun. It was difficult at first because it was so foreign to me and what I believed, but if it ever came to defending a loved one, etc.

Get Packmeyer grips rubber grips, they help the pistol remain in your hand when fired especially short-barreled pistols. You can also use. Get jacketed hollow point rounds for maximum damage to the body.

After getting good with firing that pistol, graduate up to a magnum automatic designed for short-range street combat. A couple of magnum rounds to the gut will stop most attackers unless they are cranked up on some powerful meth-like drug.

Every carjacking attempt happened at night and in or near small, rural towns here in Mississippi when I was driving around alone and had stopped. And that was back in the 70s and 80s, too, when times were fairly good economically.

To quote Robert A. An armed society is polite, as long as the people have morals. Our armed society is now an extremely dangerous society. Even the police there are not armed.

People are so stressed by fear. Fear of the economy and the fear that they are fed every day by the Media. Leadership from Congress is absent as they jockey for lobbyists dollars and try to ensure their tenure at the public trough.

The signs have been here since WWII, greed and a slow falling away from our Biblical morals and laws. It actually started soon after the pilgrims landed. President Wilson tried to put it on the front burner, that is globalism, and now the liberals are rolling on the floor laughing while the heart of America is asleep.

As long as the liberals are alive and well, they will lead us striaght to hell. Obama is their instrument, the voters their pawns. Greed by a few like a rotten apple. The sickness is home in Wash DC and spreading out from there, corruption, racketering, and outright executive orders breaking the laws of the constitution.

Decisions for Arabs freedom after breaking laws or terrorist activities. This administration needs to be thrown out with the trash, impeach the man, if you got any sense.

A sucker for those that control your life. You are serf and you beg at your masters feet for the crumbs that are dropped on the floor. You are brainwashed and will rot in hell with those that you condemn there.

You are indeed a Christian as you are a hypocrite. Where are you from? Do you live in a crack in the wall, underground, in delusion? When our Society finally hits bottom and it will, you will need more than abrassive words to survive.

You will need friends, family, or neighbors to help you, food, supplies, protection, some place SAFE to live, etc. If you have destroyed all the positive people around you, all that will be left is the negative ones that will only drag you down into their holes of despair.

Hold fast with what you have, and try and help in the restructuring of culture. God has been pushed to the back burner and Society is self destructing. Protect yourself and your loved ones…bring God close to help guide your lives.

Those prepared and who remain strong will see the other side. Remember, this crap will end. Our job is to get it right if we are presented the opportunity. I bet you dont even know who runs your publishing houses.

They are disgusting immoral scum. No, its liberal democrat jacks like yourself who are too lazy and ignorant. Quit blaming others for your incompetance. About about your criminal bankers, they white and they do even more danmage.

The racial makeup of the gang will depend on the demographics of the city. Does it really matter the color of the hand that holds the weapon trying to hurt you or kill you or rape you?

Having had a white man try to rape me and a black man try to carjack my ride, do you think I care what racial makeup the punk is? I agree with you on that one.

Watched an episode of gangland where Asian gangs killing people in Chinatown and new York. I recommend watching it sometime. Fact of the matter is, many people care more about their dogs and cats, than about their fellow human beings.

In much of the world, the population tends to be homogenous — of one ethnic origin or religuous belief. In those countries, there are very few black Swedes, or Nigerians of Japanese ancestry.

Not so here… The U. Now it looks as if it about to fall apart. Racism is rearing its ugly head yet again, compounded by financial difficulties and hardship a common denominator in the road to ruin.

Totally incorrect, but extremely effective among the desperate masses Adolf Hitler twisted that, and used it to the extreme. First, learn more about each other. Then, try to help each other, in spite of our individual differences and beliefs.

We are all in this Mess together. I dare you to do so. It is one thing to read Fairy Tales The Diary of…. Coudenhove Kalergi, Vienna From your comments, you seem to be a product of the current education system.

If you cannot be bothered to study history, and insist on regurgitating the pablum fed to you, then how can you help the others. Not all beliefs are equally valid.

To pull some one up, you need a solid footing, otherwise you just get pulled down to their level. I cannot recall the reference or source, but a renowned source suggests that West African Model, is the future of society, i.

Plan your exit, and remember that the last helicopter will likely be overcrowded. When times get tough, people always look for a scapegoat to blame, no matter how innocent they may be.

Any religious or racial group who are perceived as being wealthy makes a convenient target for hate. You know the anne franks story never happen right? It was a lie.

Just like saddam killing babies out of their incubators. Once again, people fall for the lie for war. I believe we called it a false flag attack, like the gulf of token. I beg to differ. Anne Frank actually was a real person, who wrote a diary while hiding from the Nazis.

You need to get them onside. Klom, it appears you are misguided about the police when it comes to protecting the citizens. When the proverbial poop hits the fan here is the order of people the police will protect: Thanks to the world trade organization, and free trade.

Many of you dont know who the first president to propose so called free trade was? It was ronald reagan. Free trade with china was first implemented with china under bush sr, then newt and the republicans that controlled house and senate pushed nafta on clinton, and he went along.

Big money deregulated the banks and big oil. Next bush jr normalized free trade with china, as he cut taxes and started 2 unfunded wars. Where did they think America would go with no jobs and with huge debts by unfunded wars?

This was because of lobbyists and campaign donations. Our politicians work for corporations, not for the good of the people. Until we get rid of lobbyists and corporate or large campaign donations our govt will not work for the American people, which is the fundamental problem hat caused the other problems, but no politicians are able to break the hold big money has over our politicians.

Eliminate tax loopholes for corporations re: Renegotiate prescription drug bill and end the wars for the Lukid party in Israel Iraq and afganistan. Reduce defense spending to levels. So take care my friends and get prepared as best as you can.

We are living in Orwells nightmare dystopia. We are nothing but a military police state run by the big corporations. Just listen to the Republican plans! Both parties vote for more wars.

This is the plan. Wake up people and quit voting for these people. The signs you mentioned in your report are the symptoms. My security is in my wealth. Why are we surprised with the end result!

There is a way out, but the likelihood of that happening is almost nil II Chronicles 7: We have hardened our hearts against God. Things will get worse as time goes by!

I for one have resolved to live according to the commands of God. This was a big part of my decision 3 years ago to move to a remote a place as possible - a Pacific Island.

It may not be all roses when the SHTF, but I think it will be better than a population center big mainland city. Trust me and listen to me! I know better than everyone else that is posting on the internet.

And to keep us all at peace instead of blaming each other about the collapse of our nation - and not them! Be honest all you care about is cowardly yourself.

So go make all the noise you want on these boards. That smirk is asking an important question so listen up…. The American population could feel this coming though. Academics wrote books and treatises on the problems.

But none of you wanted to do anything about it except get rage-filled and start blaming everyone else. Definitely… So I left. Rail and whine all you want. I said what I felt I should.

Who could actually take themselves seriously after saying something like that. What I find most infuriating is how there is so massive an emphasis on faith and God.

Now, regardless of my personal views on religion, yes, I am an atheist, but I insist on being a moral, conscientious person, what seems to be one of the issues here, is that so many people seem to be under the impression that things would be better if only they were better Christians.

God, or lack thereof, is not the issue here. People are the issue. Rome was a great Christian nation by the time it fell, as was the British Empire, and they both began to fall apart because of their own decadent, apathetic stupidity.

God did not help them. Too many people are having faith that God will solve your problems, and this is incorrect. Surely, any God worth their salt will be more proud of men and women who solve their own problems?

There have always been religious wars and there will continue to be religious wars. We are in fact experiencing them now Islam vs Christianity. Problem is, now nukes are likely to become involved!

With Biblical Principles gone, our nation is dead already. We will go bankrupt first either literally via default or effectively via massive devaluation of the US Dollar. Well, I live in the so-called third world and we have in no such problems here.

A well-written and well-documented article. I pine for the America of our past and fear for the Amerika we have now. Our economy, society, and culture is about to take a swan-dive into the abyss.

God knows when an where it will end. Below is a trailer of the movie https: We as individuals are part of the problem. If we just enjoy the abundance this great nation has to offer and give noting back to enrich each other — — nothing good will come.

The exchange has to happen for there to be balance. Without balance this society will implode and the initial signs are just the tip of the iceberg. Standing on the sidelines, wringing our hands and writing comments on the internet will not solve the problem…..

This country was founded on small groups coming together and helping each other and growing in size as the years went on. Each of has inside us the desire for self preservation. If we help each other in our local communities we will bond together, support and protect each other.

Perhaps this sounds utopian, but the rest of the world shows us that fighting does not solve anything. The Bible teaches that what we are seeing is a revelation of the true nature of man.

Becoming a Christian does not take away this old nature, but adds a new nature with which to combat our old one. It also teaches us that we are going to give an account to God.

Sadly, many churches have been complicit in this betrayal. With God having been relegated to irrelevance or incompetence, it is no wonder that fear of retribution from Him is no longer a restraining factor on evil in society.

Government not only fails to act as a restraining factor by often taking the side of criminals against victims, but all three branches violate the Constitutional rights of Americans every day.

Unfortunately, when the final Economic Collapse happens, it will be much worse than now. Hopefully, these mobs will wipe out some of the politicians that have caused this mess. At least the rich lobbyists who have corrupted the country beyond redemption will have to stay behind walls, or face death on the streets.

Ominously, what happens in America usually happens elsewhere not long afterwards. Democracy appears to be a good idea, but once people get the notion that they can vote themselves largesse from the public trough, the writing is on the wall.

The unspoken problem that no one has mentioned is our educational system. Historically, children are taught by adults in an environment with adults and mixed age groups. The children learn from others with more experience.

Then look at our public schools. With no essentially no adult input, it is not surprising they grow up to be hoodlums. What to do what to do. Think this is going to turn-around?

Think we will resume values and scruples and respect? Think a government who rewards corruption will grow a conscience? Think decades of media violence and bravado for war meant nothing on the pysches of humans?

More specifically critical thinking. America was always a pretend institution. Money helped it limp along with the facade. Do this do that, we are a little late.

Immagration should have been shut down in the early thirties. Term limits might have helped us some. Polititians should never had more than two terms of two years.

The longer they are in office the worse they get. The whole government is sick. Will we have gangs and thugs that want to break in your house?? You bet-I just bought 3 more guns and ammo.

Do I strap on my 38 to go to Wal-Mart, yes indeed I do. We can do that where I live.

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An aging gracefully citizen. No pledge of allegiance, no ten commandments, Etc. We can blame ourselves, the American people, for not standing up and allowing the Govt to have done so. Can we fix this?

Vote all the bums out and make sure we put people into office who will stand by our God and our constitution. Oh, I wonder how these gangs would respond if they were confronted with armed citizens prepared to defend themselves.

The finished work of the socialist dream. Look at the big picture also. Several years ago I came to the conclusion that we are in the first century of a middle age period.

All of the empires and colonial powers have disappeared since except for three — US, India and China. Governments are decentralizing all over. The US government is experiencing political seizures, and has begun to pass and enforce laws which are anti-democratic and arbitrary.

Immigration has been accelerating since as more people from more places seek safety. World finance is being destroyed by inflation in all countries 4. Inflation is destroying the access to higher education by the middle class.

The gap between the wealthy and the middle class is widening as the banksters and others steal more and more from both shareholders and taxpayers. Food is becoming more expensive and therefore beyond the means of many people.

Government spending is totally out of control and becoming increasingly capricious. The Federal government is subsidizing corn production for ethanol production an extremely inefficient process which takes land out of food production.

Unemployment worldwide is increasing at an alarming rate, which means that many more poor families are being created. Business is trying to hide monetary inflation by providing products in smaller quantities the ounce quart and ounce half gallon and lower quality.

For more information on middle age periods, read 1. Michael Grant — The Climax of Rome esp. An account of the first middle age period B. Morris Bishop — The Middle Ages. The second middle age period A.

Things do not have to go this far if people will take charge and demand constructive change. We have something that earlier ages did not possess. But never in the history of the world have we had horribly wicked International Bankers that are ruling our planet.

And their wickedness will have you enslaved and going to hell in no time. For they are serving Lucifer; and he has taught them how to rob and steal great wealth to enslave the whole world.

And now; they are planning to put their mark of the beast chip in everybodies forehead or hand; so you will become their brainless zombie slave. Because Revelation 13 and 14 talks about this.

But those of us who will reject and resist this chip, will be martyred and killed. While horrific, none of the examples given are anything new, other than the ready access to things not previously brought to light cell-phone cameras and the internet have provided us.

You have a screw loose. I bet you are from California…. I live in a rural area of the Midwest. In my area we have been able to sleep well enough and always known our neighbors — up until a few months ago I did not lock my cars or my home most of the time — there was no need.

That has changed, neighbors are now siphoning gas out of cars from desperation, and stealing scrap lumber, metal, livestock, produce and anything else they can get their hands on to sell or eat.

Over the last year or so the police departments of some areas have started taking these seriously and actually investigated and caught a few. They are sometimes groups of people working together to amass resources to sell.

We now keep a vigilant eye on our little flock of chickens and we have a colony of rabbits as well. We keep any resources away from the road on the back side of our property — we also keep two German Shepherd Dogs for guarding our property.

Living in the country is NOT what it used to be. Even here, though the violence is not as prevalent yet, life has certainly changed for the worse. I believe it will get much worse — thank God we are an armed and capable household.

It is sad, but necessary. In America our idyllic country living is not what it used to be and may never be again. I rarely comment but was thinking last night I need to post up a kudo as I check and read your site every day.

A big thank you to you and everyone else that visits the site on a regular basis. It is appreciated more than you know. I cannot urge everyone enough — start storing food. If you think it is bad now, just wait to see what happens if the teabaggers and other radical groups are successful in cutting off welfare payments.

Oh, let me clarify. Do radicals really think these people are going to politely move to the streets with there families and be content with eating out of garbage cans?

That this is now considered to be radical is really the crux of the problem. Since when do Americans stand around waiting to be fed? Did the pilgrims do that? The problem is everyone sitting around complaining that nobody is helping them or doing anything FOR them.

This is what happens when you throw out God. Historically very poor societies have been civilized places. Material poverty is not the problem— spiritual poverty is. We should all start going back to church.

Well first of all those things have been happening in. Chicago for a long time honestly how long do u expect people to work for pebbles while the people there working for are making billions off of them?

Second how long can u tell someone to do as I say not as I do, before they say f that if u can do it so can I? Only ONE thing is needed to restore and maintain law and order in this country: Otherwise, face the consequences of street rule by human-animals.

Only a legally permissable billy-club — or more — up side the head is the way to prevent or stop that kind of barbaric behavior. My husband and I have spent the last 4 years prepping and educating ourselves on what can and WILL be coming down the pike and trying very hard to prepare ourselves for it.

Meanwhile, we live in an area where most folks are more concerned about redecorating their homes, buying new cars, taking their 11 year olds to Lady GaGa concerts, shopping, etc.

I felt like I was having an out of body experience. I seriously cannot relate to these people anymore. I stopped trying to talk to people about the economy….

Sorry for the rant…. I live in Atlanta Georgia. Everyday there are signs. Babysitter kills toddler, 2 shot outside teen party, Brick thrown from I overpass and several more.

I forgot to add this. The something that earlier ages did not have is perspective and knowledge of history. Things were much different than they are now. I think that was the begining of what we see now.

I have moved to a remote spot, started a garden, gotten a 2 year supply of food and am armed, a shotgun with 00 buck and handguns. When things get bad it will not be possible to go out of the house.

One should have basic necessities to keep one alive until the worst is over. In the end only those who have hearts and faith in God Almighty will be left, if He so wills it.

I agree the possibility of an economic collapse is real but I think these are only circumstantial points. I grew up hearing about craziness like this all the time. I do agree things are getting more out of control and will research the statistics of how much worse things are.

I am sure I will find that crime has accelerated dramatically when broken down into numbers. We have to get back to shared values, as embodied in the Constitution: Sure free trade has significantly dropped the price of goods but at what cost?

Yes, it is spreading everywhere. The tsunami if immigration legal and illegal since combined with the worship of diversity which dicourages cultural assimilation of immigrants, has destroyed the cohesion of our society.

Hyphenated Americanism has caused our nation to become the polyglot boarding house Theodore Roosevelt warned against. I agree that things are falling apart very quickly in this country.

I also agree with you, Michael, that at the root of all of it is the moral decline of the people in this country, and the complete and utter selfishness of people that goes along with it.

I am blessed enough to live in a city that is unusually wealthy compared to the rest of the country. I am, however, still seeing many signs of the economic crisis, and the collapse of society in general.

I know it is only going to get much worse in the next few years. These are people who have excellent resumes, experience, and skills. They are becoming very frustrated.

Seeing this makes me feel very grateful that both me and my husband still have good jobs that we enjoy. This is in a city that used to make the list in top places to live in the U.

My husband and I have our first baby on the way, due this summer. It is hard to put into words the heaviness and sadness I feel thinking about how different her childhood will be from what mine was.

I absolutely know things are going to get much worse, and it will not be easy. I am trying to do my best to prepare spiritually, emotionally, and physically. I think the most important thing will be to trust God, and be prepared to live through a period of extreme turbulence and difficulty without turning away from what is moral and right.

The only way out of this is to get the crooks in Washington D. We need to set an example for them and instill real values in their lives. The crooks that are running this once wonderful country into the ground need to be made into an example as well, they need to be taught that they work for us, the citizens of the UNITED States of America.

OK, I see this is long term, but if we start on this path, we will get to our destination. In the meantime, urge all who will listen to buy American and try to consume a little less from overseas manufacturers, esp.

China who will not let their currency float on the exchanges, thereby making the fiscal playing field so unfair. God Bless you and Protect you on your mission. I am a licensed clinical social worker by profession.

In my daily clinical work there is an increase in mental health issues, the collapse of families, an increase in domestic violence against women and children, a rise in pedophilia and sex crimes, the youth desensitization towards violence and personal accountability, and a general indifference of society towards the welfare of others.

What is particularly troubling is the Washington lawmakers are even more corrupt now than in the early 90s when I was a Capital Hill staffer on the U. Senate Select Committee on Ethics. The psychology, psychiatric, and licensed clinical social work research studies indicate that when unemployment is high and the economy is poor there is an increase in violence, crime, and poor mental health.

I fear this is only the tip of the iceberg. What is your advice regarding the economic collapse of America? Something no one has mentioned is that the Chinese own us because they hold our debt.

Eventually they will appear on our shores and take what they want. We still need a strong military for this very reason. I would like to hear your thoughts. Talk about the law of unintended consequences.

I live in Orange County, CA. And here in CA. THAT costs 3x the national average. Times, say, 15 million. They sneak back a second time, another brand. Perhaps the most embarrassing should be the invasion of Grenada.

What harm could they ever do to us. Also our government totally missed the point with communism. It was a parasitic economy which was using up all its wealth for military development while forcing its people to live in abject poverty and virtual slavery.

Now the US has also become a parasitic nation destroying the working class to enrich the already super-rich parasites, who finance our elections so that our only choice is picking a candidate which is still going to make them still richer while continuing to impoverish the working class.

The gap between rich and working class has been widening for decades. So what is now the difference between them and us? It is a true and sad fact that Americans the youth in particular have lost their way and the we can only hope and pray for them.

We also need to be an example and provide guidance whenever we have the opportunity. God Save America and her people. Everyone wants to know what the meaning of life is. That concept has been taken from our society and we are witnessing the result.

Those who shine at living life actually take action to correct that which is wrong. Obama and Ghandi both now that the deadliest form of violence is poverty! The big difference is that Obama welcomes it and Ghandi tried to lead people to escape from it.

The evidence is in-there is a super massive black hole in the center of our galaxy and even a bigger one in DC. And I do think theres a reason why we are still pretty much at peace here.

Something that got lost in the cities of America, where populations are so large, passersby are hardly recognized as fellow human beings. I am not entirely sure that the roots for this upcoming social catastrophe reside in economic conditions alone.

For decades, the moral fiber of the world has been deliberately corrupted. The psychopathic Rothschilds have worked very us on convincing us all that we are as vile and murderous and greedy as they are.

We read about the senseless killing of Arabs, with excuses intended only to thinly disguise the true reasons: We suspect our government killed Pat Tillman and MLK, and they have conditioned us to accept such horrors as if life without principle is indeed worth living.

They have worked hard, very hard, on corrupting us, and they have succeeded, at least when it comes to most Americans. I hope, that then in America more cities should be razed and more civilizations be drawn closer.

That will probably declare landlocked nations for native americans. The power of Fed is gone, so are the enforcement of reservations treaties, the indians will roam around San Francisco and Newyork herding their cattle, farming corn and wildoats in Austin, Denver and Tulsa.

The agreement of reservation life is over. I did not expect that America would be independent in, expand by Louisiana purchase, grab massive territory which displaced my tribal affiliates in greater Mexico, later declare American empire, massacre of Lakota Sioux.

What a powerful America it was! Now it shall be a junk if 17 states not withdraw from 32 other. I see an advocate on my country farm and calling me buy more land, a blue-white winged bird.

Its Sheba here… Where the King of Kings lives. America will be beautiful and wealthy if you divide into two Federations, East and West. Almost all of these examples are overblown and isolated incidents.

You sir are a retard. I live in Fargo, ND and we have been having a rash of crime lately. In the past 6 months we have had multiple gas station robberies, bank robberies, and the latest, a shooting at one of our three movie theaters.

I am no racist but when you cobble together all these nationalities into one area, Bosnians, Somalis, Mexicans, Whites, etc. When I was a kid these types of things never happened.

I sort of feel pretty good about living at the top right corner of the country, since life here is not so hectic. So, all that you have posted above is possible here in Maine, but as of yet, we nothing like that happening here at the moment.

Kind of a chickenshit thing to say. What you really mean is that that the character of the welfare scumbags and urban morons will come out. These are not our countrymen, and not Americans.

What many good Americans will see, however, is the telescopic image of the losers heads in their rifle scopes. Time to man up. If you or your family are threatened by any kind of these criminal idiots, kill them.

Do the world a favor. Self defense is not a crime. If you live in any of the urban centers of the USA and you are not armed then you are part of the problem. Show me a jury that will convict someone who is defending themselves or their family or other innocent people.

Better yet, get out of the cesspools that cities have become and start living like human beings again. Time to choose sides. Which will you be on? All of this observant commentary about young people in America beginning to act like third world savages is alarmingly true.

In some areas of the country, the age old teenage rebellious tradition of selling weed is no longer profitable as the average consumer dollar shrinks. Having millions of broke, jobless, directionless, shiftless kids around from the suburbs to the inner city is not the recipe for a civil society.

This extreme neglect and economic deprivation of young people, particularly young minorities, is turing them into animals. About a month ago I was robbed in broad daylight walking to the store on a picture perfect 75 degree sunny day at 1 PM by two high school dropout teenagers on the path in my nice suburban town which is located in third richest county in America!

A few months before that I was beaten unconscious by random drunk young people on the path near my home that I woke up in the hospital getting stitches in my face. This will be one dangerous summer for places all across America.

Latin America has been plundered by the USA, what you are seeing now and your own politicians stealing and doing all of you idiots, as they always have with us hope you feel on the skin which here in latin america feel in relation to its political, would you read a good bit of history, Americans and Mexicans are different only in the culture and language, all other things are equal to you, American patriotism and a way to fool the people to do what obama bush and company limited are sending their children to die, that has nothing of patriotism, rinse your mouth before talking to us.

USA open your mind now the rulers are undermining their own nation. Gabriel, I will be the first to admit we have corrupt leaders over the US, but so does Mexico. How can you say the US has plundered Latin America when immigrants pour over the border illegally and use up US resources such as education and health care?

Are they paying taxes to the US for these benefits? The US is being plundered by the self-entitled people of Mexico who believe not in US law, but break it daily.

Just prepare yourself spiritually because material possessions, or the thought of losing them, will only worry you sick. And remember, things must get worse before they can get better.

Or so we hope. You are so right. Material things will become bait, the attractant leading to these thugs wanting to come into your home and assault you as society breaks down.

The History Channel has a good survival program, usually ran with the nuclear apocalypse in D. Civilization is a thin veneer over our more savage nature. And civilization is a luxury of wealth.

The inevitable reduction in the American standard of living, especially that of the poorest classes, will strip away much of this facade. Poverty, relative as it is, has produced numerous groups who have little investment in the status quo, and little to lose other than social restraint.

Revolution, viewed as an anarchic breakdown of order, is the belief of those with more at stake in the current social structures. Look at Japan, did they have epidemic murder, looting and rap as in New Orleane?

Was there widspread looting in Moscow during the power shortages? I live in San Mateo County, CA and there are more and more reports of robberies, vandalism and violence going on every week.

San Jose, CA is seeing a huge rise in homicides as well. Thank you for saying that. A lot of hard work goes into all of this and it is encouraging to hear that all of the hard work is appreciated.

Being born in to parents who were teachers, I grew up wrong. Marrying my wife saved me, and having children pulled me hard right. Even then, I ignored politics except for the 2nd admendment.

I only took the kids to church every now and again. I selfishly left the big city I grew up in to live in a small town in the heartland for my childrens sake.

My selfishness has destroyed this country. I should have been a better Christian, and held public officials to better morals and higher standards. When that failed, I should have ran myself for office, or given more of my time and support money to officials who had the proper respect for life and liberty.

I am approaching a time, were I can do this, but the hour I fear is to late. Had me, as a Christian done more, it could have been a better world. I cry for my children, and thank God he at least gave me the sense to get out of high population densities.

Funny, when I was 8ish I was scared that I would die in nuclear war with Russia, when I was 17ish, learning how to write pascal in highschool, i thought I would be able to visit the moon around the year I apologize for my inactions and misspellings.

May God bless this Once Great Nation again. I tend to think this is what happens to a society that goes to long without troubles or tribulations as a whole. It is like a relationship the strongest ones are the tried and tested ones.

Most like myself only socialize with a select few and up until a few weeks ago I had no idea even who my neighbors were. I assumed like myself they preferred to be left alone. I was surprised to find they were more than happy to make my acquaintance as I was theirs.

Makka you have made the first step, you have found and admitted your mistake. The next step is change. How do you get from where you are to where you want to be? That has also been my situation.

Do you know your neighbors? Do you have storage of dry goods, alternate power, protection? You have to start really where you live Makka. We know whats coming and its only to late if you give up.

You were sorry for your inaction well there is no better time then now for being proactive. Get out there meet the people around you form a block watch or group.

Learn to get back to basics and survival skills. Someone may need you. When cash welfare stops. The cities, all of them will become violent to the extream. Hungry people will do anything to get food.

Cash welfare is paid out of workers taxes. Food stamps are paid for by taxes. Section 8 housing vouchers are paid out of taxes. WIC is paid for out of taxes. When these and many other giveaway programs are forced to be abandoned then real trouble will start.

I left my home in Texas 10 years ago to study physics in Germany. I had been looking forward to coming home after finishing my doctorate next year, but now do not see how that will be possible.

My family still seems mostly oblivious to the new country developing around them but from here the situation looks dire. As a physicist, I will have to live and work in a city — are there any safe cities left in the US?

I got my PhD in the US, and had to flee to a foreign nation. America is collapsing more so now that money is being printed to purchase government debt.

Academia in the US is in its last legs, at least in my field Mathematics. I try teaching in an elite private college for a while, but found myself teaching courses like differential equations to people who could not even add fractions and who were majoring in engineering and lacked reasoning skills… The chair explained to me that unless I gave students grades of C or above, the school would lose money because many of those students would transfer.

So I had to alter my standards. Civilization is breaking down, that is a fact. Although economic collapse will serve as a catalyst. A moral person will continue to be a moral person whether they are rich or poor.

We have become a nation without principles. The moral fabric of the nation has become ripped. People from all sorts of economic strata are losing their moral compasses as things implode.

The Lord will not prosper this people if they continue to violate his commandments. However, that is but one thorn on a rose stem. Without giving over your life to God and His path, you will never approach that glorious rose at the top!

There will be many thorns to spear your side, but as long as you keep climbing beyond them, the Rose will be reached and a New World will open to you. Until Society reaches the absolute bottom and starts to rebound on a more positive note, you will need all the items listed to get you through.

Most importantly will be prayer, alone, and with others as worship. Everything about our country is in decline. Moral collapse is just a part of it. I hate guns but for the first time a couple years ago I finally looked into buying a weapon for our home.

The media kept talking about how more people are buying guns because Obama got elected and gun afficionados were afraid of him outlawing their guns. What are these people going to do when the dam really breaks?

I highly recommend you purchase a fire arm for protection. If you do, and have no experience with a gun, you need to get training on the safe operation of a gun. Many people I know are buying guns and a decent supply of ammo, many people are waking up to whats happening to this country.

God help us all. What makes you think the bad guys will tell you when they buy guns? Husbands, fathers, brothers, or who ever has any knowledge about guns — teach your family members how to safely use one and the precautions that go along with guns.

If you have no knowledge of guns, find a friend or family member who does. Learn how to handle one and teach your loved ones to do the same. I have always hated guns, but my spouse took me out to shoot and learn how to handle a gun.

It was difficult at first because it was so foreign to me and what I believed, but if it ever came to defending a loved one, etc. Get Packmeyer grips rubber grips, they help the pistol remain in your hand when fired especially short-barreled pistols.

You can also use. Get jacketed hollow point rounds for maximum damage to the body. After getting good with firing that pistol, graduate up to a magnum automatic designed for short-range street combat.

A couple of magnum rounds to the gut will stop most attackers unless they are cranked up on some powerful meth-like drug. Every carjacking attempt happened at night and in or near small, rural towns here in Mississippi when I was driving around alone and had stopped.

And that was back in the 70s and 80s, too, when times were fairly good economically. To quote Robert A. An armed society is polite, as long as the people have morals.

Our armed society is now an extremely dangerous society. Even the police there are not armed. People are so stressed by fear. Fear of the economy and the fear that they are fed every day by the Media.

Leadership from Congress is absent as they jockey for lobbyists dollars and try to ensure their tenure at the public trough. The signs have been here since WWII, greed and a slow falling away from our Biblical morals and laws.

It actually started soon after the pilgrims landed. President Wilson tried to put it on the front burner, that is globalism, and now the liberals are rolling on the floor laughing while the heart of America is asleep.

As long as the liberals are alive and well, they will lead us striaght to hell. Obama is their instrument, the voters their pawns. Greed by a few like a rotten apple. The sickness is home in Wash DC and spreading out from there, corruption, racketering, and outright executive orders breaking the laws of the constitution.

Decisions for Arabs freedom after breaking laws or terrorist activities. This administration needs to be thrown out with the trash, impeach the man, if you got any sense. A sucker for those that control your life.

You are serf and you beg at your masters feet for the crumbs that are dropped on the floor. You are brainwashed and will rot in hell with those that you condemn there. You are indeed a Christian as you are a hypocrite.

Where are you from? Do you live in a crack in the wall, underground, in delusion? When our Society finally hits bottom and it will, you will need more than abrassive words to survive.

You will need friends, family, or neighbors to help you, food, supplies, protection, some place SAFE to live, etc. If you have destroyed all the positive people around you, all that will be left is the negative ones that will only drag you down into their holes of despair.

Hold fast with what you have, and try and help in the restructuring of culture. God has been pushed to the back burner and Society is self destructing.

Protect yourself and your loved ones…bring God close to help guide your lives. Those prepared and who remain strong will see the other side. Remember, this crap will end. Our job is to get it right if we are presented the opportunity.

I bet you dont even know who runs your publishing houses. They are disgusting immoral scum. No, its liberal democrat jacks like yourself who are too lazy and ignorant. Quit blaming others for your incompetance.

About about your criminal bankers, they white and they do even more danmage. The racial makeup of the gang will depend on the demographics of the city. Does it really matter the color of the hand that holds the weapon trying to hurt you or kill you or rape you?

Having had a white man try to rape me and a black man try to carjack my ride, do you think I care what racial makeup the punk is? I agree with you on that one. Watched an episode of gangland where Asian gangs killing people in Chinatown and new York.

I recommend watching it sometime. Fact of the matter is, many people care more about their dogs and cats, than about their fellow human beings. In much of the world, the population tends to be homogenous — of one ethnic origin or religuous belief.

In those countries, there are very few black Swedes, or Nigerians of Japanese ancestry. Not so here… The U. Now it looks as if it about to fall apart. Racism is rearing its ugly head yet again, compounded by financial difficulties and hardship a common denominator in the road to ruin.

Totally incorrect, but extremely effective among the desperate masses Adolf Hitler twisted that, and used it to the extreme. First, learn more about each other.

Then, try to help each other, in spite of our individual differences and beliefs. We are all in this Mess together. I dare you to do so. It is one thing to read Fairy Tales The Diary of….

Coudenhove Kalergi, Vienna From your comments, you seem to be a product of the current education system. If you cannot be bothered to study history, and insist on regurgitating the pablum fed to you, then how can you help the others.

Not all beliefs are equally valid. To pull some one up, you need a solid footing, otherwise you just get pulled down to their level. I cannot recall the reference or source, but a renowned source suggests that West African Model, is the future of society, i.

Plan your exit, and remember that the last helicopter will likely be overcrowded. When times get tough, people always look for a scapegoat to blame, no matter how innocent they may be.

Any religious or racial group who are perceived as being wealthy makes a convenient target for hate. You know the anne franks story never happen right? It was a lie. Just like saddam killing babies out of their incubators.

Once again, people fall for the lie for war. I believe we called it a false flag attack, like the gulf of token. I beg to differ. Anne Frank actually was a real person, who wrote a diary while hiding from the Nazis.

You need to get them onside. Klom, it appears you are misguided about the police when it comes to protecting the citizens. When the proverbial poop hits the fan here is the order of people the police will protect: Thanks to the world trade organization, and free trade.

Many of you dont know who the first president to propose so called free trade was? It was ronald reagan. Free trade with china was first implemented with china under bush sr, then newt and the republicans that controlled house and senate pushed nafta on clinton, and he went along.

Big money deregulated the banks and big oil. Next bush jr normalized free trade with china, as he cut taxes and started 2 unfunded wars. Where did they think America would go with no jobs and with huge debts by unfunded wars?

This was because of lobbyists and campaign donations. Our politicians work for corporations, not for the good of the people. Until we get rid of lobbyists and corporate or large campaign donations our govt will not work for the American people, which is the fundamental problem hat caused the other problems, but no politicians are able to break the hold big money has over our politicians.

Eliminate tax loopholes for corporations re: Renegotiate prescription drug bill and end the wars for the Lukid party in Israel Iraq and afganistan. Reduce defense spending to levels.

So take care my friends and get prepared as best as you can. We are living in Orwells nightmare dystopia. We are nothing but a military police state run by the big corporations. Just listen to the Republican plans!

Both parties vote for more wars. This is the plan. Wake up people and quit voting for these people. The signs you mentioned in your report are the symptoms. My security is in my wealth.

Why are we surprised with the end result! There is a way out, but the likelihood of that happening is almost nil II Chronicles 7: We have hardened our hearts against God. Things will get worse as time goes by!

I for one have resolved to live according to the commands of God. This was a big part of my decision 3 years ago to move to a remote a place as possible - a Pacific Island. It may not be all roses when the SHTF, but I think it will be better than a population center big mainland city.

Trust me and listen to me! I know better than everyone else that is posting on the internet. And to keep us all at peace instead of blaming each other about the collapse of our nation - and not them!

Be honest all you care about is cowardly yourself. So go make all the noise you want on these boards. That smirk is asking an important question so listen up….

The American population could feel this coming though. Academics wrote books and treatises on the problems. But none of you wanted to do anything about it except get rage-filled and start blaming everyone else.

Definitely… So I left. Rail and whine all you want. I said what I felt I should. Who could actually take themselves seriously after saying something like that.

What I find most infuriating is how there is so massive an emphasis on faith and God. Now, regardless of my personal views on religion, yes, I am an atheist, but I insist on being a moral, conscientious person, what seems to be one of the issues here, is that so many people seem to be under the impression that things would be better if only they were better Christians.

God, or lack thereof, is not the issue here. People are the issue. Rome was a great Christian nation by the time it fell, as was the British Empire, and they both began to fall apart because of their own decadent, apathetic stupidity.

God did not help them. Too many people are having faith that God will solve your problems, and this is incorrect. Surely, any God worth their salt will be more proud of men and women who solve their own problems?

There have always been religious wars and there will continue to be religious wars. We are in fact experiencing them now Islam vs Christianity. Problem is, now nukes are likely to become involved!

With Biblical Principles gone, our nation is dead already. We will go bankrupt first either literally via default or effectively via massive devaluation of the US Dollar.

Well, I live in the so-called third world and we have in no such problems here. A well-written and well-documented article. I pine for the America of our past and fear for the Amerika we have now.

Our economy, society, and culture is about to take a swan-dive into the abyss. God knows when an where it will end. Below is a trailer of the movie https: We as individuals are part of the problem.

If we just enjoy the abundance this great nation has to offer and give noting back to enrich each other — — nothing good will come. The exchange has to happen for there to be balance.

Without balance this society will implode and the initial signs are just the tip of the iceberg. Standing on the sidelines, wringing our hands and writing comments on the internet will not solve the problem…..

This country was founded on small groups coming together and helping each other and growing in size as the years went on. Each of has inside us the desire for self preservation. If we help each other in our local communities we will bond together, support and protect each other.

Perhaps this sounds utopian, but the rest of the world shows us that fighting does not solve anything. The Bible teaches that what we are seeing is a revelation of the true nature of man. Becoming a Christian does not take away this old nature, but adds a new nature with which to combat our old one.

It also teaches us that we are going to give an account to God. Sadly, many churches have been complicit in this betrayal. With God having been relegated to irrelevance or incompetence, it is no wonder that fear of retribution from Him is no longer a restraining factor on evil in society.

Government not only fails to act as a restraining factor by often taking the side of criminals against victims, but all three branches violate the Constitutional rights of Americans every day.

Unfortunately, when the final Economic Collapse happens, it will be much worse than now. Hopefully, these mobs will wipe out some of the politicians that have caused this mess.

At least the rich lobbyists who have corrupted the country beyond redemption will have to stay behind walls, or face death on the streets. Ominously, what happens in America usually happens elsewhere not long afterwards.

Democracy appears to be a good idea, but once people get the notion that they can vote themselves largesse from the public trough, the writing is on the wall. The unspoken problem that no one has mentioned is our educational system.

Historically, children are taught by adults in an environment with adults and mixed age groups. The children learn from others with more experience. Then look at our public schools.

With no essentially no adult input, it is not surprising they grow up to be hoodlums. What to do what to do. Think this is going to turn-around? Think we will resume values and scruples and respect?

Think a government who rewards corruption will grow a conscience? Think decades of media violence and bravado for war meant nothing on the pysches of humans? More specifically critical thinking.

America was always a pretend institution. Money helped it limp along with the facade. Do this do that, we are a little late. Immagration should have been shut down in the early thirties.

Term limits might have helped us some. Polititians should never had more than two terms of two years. The longer they are in office the worse they get. The whole government is sick.

Will we have gangs and thugs that want to break in your house?? You bet-I just bought 3 more guns and ammo. Do I strap on my 38 to go to Wal-Mart, yes indeed I do. We can do that where I live.

Is there any break ins here or robbery?? No, even the illegals know what the consequence will be. Oh, is too bad?? Obummass wants my guns, will he get them?? The world as we have known it is definitely changing as we look on.

Yet, the world has been firmly in the grip of change for at least the last hald millenium or more. In that time period entire peoples, languages and cultures have disappeared. In America we have enjoyed an almost unheard of prosperity for the last sixty years or more.

And neither hand wringing, nor wailing, nor guns will change it. Only we can change it. The problem is not economic nor political, nor even religious, it is us, each of us. We have allowed this state of affairs to come about through our own inaction, our on lack of concern, and our own abdication of thought and reason, giving it to others who are supposed to know better.

I am not fond of democray, since it is at bottom, mob rule. But we were givng a republic here, and have reached this sorry state because as citizens we have not upheld our part of the republic—to stand guard, be ever vigilant, and informed, so that we not only make the best decisions for oursleves but make absolutely certain that those we elect are forever held accountable for what they do or fail to do.

When things were great we for the most part kept silent when we knew and saw things occuring which we knew were not right. And now we face the consequencies of our own inaction.

WOW — not nice to read first!! Peace here in my part of TN. Still feel something in turmoil deep inside as though something unknown is about to pop. New grandson — what will his future be??

I am old and have had a decent life and look forward to going to Heaven to be with Jesus. If you knew the Bible you would know that this world is corrupted by sin and without hope.

I have a tiny 45mm f1. You know google has patents for it as well probably more? They were the first ones to start working on AR with project tango. A different tech than Tango but it works, and probably works better.

Apple is actually now first to come out with real, large scale deployment of AI specific chip Neural Engine for on-device machine learning. Androids will be playing catch up with that for years to come.

Pixel 2 comes with a similar chip it seems but Pixel 2 is going to sell as well as the Pixel, which is hardly a blip. The difference here is iPhones will have a headstart with hardware based 3D sensing while even the Pixel 2 is stuck with software.

The latter is nice but having both hardware and software stabilization is obviously better. Why is Pixels not selling? Pricing has been and continues to be a joke. I think they are pushing android out of the fragmented and cheap ecosystem it is right now.

No one is asking you to buy it. I thought they were identical in build quality. I would assume that Pixel 2 is going to be of similar or better quality unless you have some hands-on experience we all missed out on.

The iPhone X uses the same tech except for a specific purpose of facial recognition. Shorter range requirements face is right in-front of the phone, so they can compress the size of the sensors.

However Apple has enough marketing strength to make it a feature that people will be excited about. Imagine a world where Apple went with fingerprint sensor under glass or on the back for the iPhone X and Pixel 2 came out with a facial recognition with 3d mapping and stuff, which one do you think you would be gushing about?

They literally have more data about its users than any other company in the world. And they have the biggest marketshare android phones using google play send info to google in the smartphone section.

Portrait mode does NOT justify what makes a good camera. I own both a Pixel and an iPhone and also am a professional photographer. This is usually the case with Apple vs.

In this case, not even original. Google even copied the Portrait mode naming. Have you tried a Pixel? When taking photos, I want basic. I want to just press the shutter button and get an excellent photo.

But the UI when the camera opens is very basic; just a viewfinder with a shutter button and a means to switch between photos and video. Effectively just the things you need to take a photo quickly and without distraction.

The Pixel has shown itself to be a very capable camera, and the Pixel 2 looks to be continuing this trend. Just look at the Pictures here. My comment is based on the original Pixel XL, not the Pixel 2; I feel it is still valid for me to comment as the camera UI and functionality is broadly the same across both the old and new devices except for the new portrait mode, of course.

My comment that the Pixel takes excellent photos is based on my experience with the original Pixel XL, not the Pixel 2. Wow that high score just got higher. I tot some photos on the 8 plus in the comparison looks more natural.

Anyway I like note 8 photos even more. Pixel is surprising to deliver Bokeh without a second lens. I always tot AI can help a lot for Bokeh and maybe having a true depth sensor like the x.

Why no score for selfie Bokeh. I think pixel wins for now. For those saying Bokeh is not important in a few years pixel will improve their AI so much we can stop bringing our prime lens around.

And with better edge detection we can do simulated f0. Lots of crying and accusations of payola? In other words, it was given to them by Google it was not purchased from another source, to be objective about the hardware, and DxOMark had the new phone with enough time to test the phone in order to release the results on the very same morning that Google announces the new phone.

They are not specific samples provided by the manufacturers! Yes, as watch companies send their watch to private companies to earn label on it before it is even announced. Sorry but your argument is unavailable.

And Google did the same thing last year. The original pixel rating was also available the day of the announcement. So what if google provided them with devices to test before hand?

The original pixel was indeed a very good if not the best at the time smartphone camera. So many butthurt Sheeples and Samsung fanboys. Do you have a Pixel 2? Do you have any proof that Google gives DxOMark those samples?

How do you explain those laboratory scene photos. He is saying that Google had control over the unit they gave DxO Mark, not that Google handed them the sample pictures. You have to snap and then rotate up.

Half the time it still errors out depending on your scenery. Without explaining this well, you make it sound like just as effective as the iPhone. Google explained in the keynote that the single camera actually uses duplicate pixels to calculate depth of field similar to how other devices use two cameras, but done within the same lens.

Thanks for taking the time to explain it. It looks unnatural and there are many artifacts. Although this site focuses on auto mode when reviewing these phone cameras. The LG V30 is made for people who actually want to use the camera settings to get the shots the way they want them.

You know, neither most of pixel nor iphone fanboys. The LG V30 is great for that by default. Let me know below. U know how machine learning works right? Like I said a few weeks ago the Pixel 2 was going to mop the floor with everything else, just accept it sheeple and others.

I am not every apple fan. What are you talking about? If we talk processor speed or something like that tho…. When comparing regular shots without the fake bokeh the original Pixel does a better job.

Apple paid back then DXOMark for a good result. And they paid a little more since the result is 4 points higher. So you deny that the model in the Pixel Images looks like a Zombie? The skintones are way off and look muddy.

The exposure is not on the subject, but on the background lightning, while both looks better on the iPhone Images. There is no limit. As far as I understand, is the reference score of the Nikon D, which was probably considered the best DSLR when the rating was created.

For the record, I come to this having developed digital imaging software for 20 years. The Pixel 2 is superb, showing minimal image processing artifacts. Details are fine and natural. Now compare the iPhone 8 image.

The test chart becomes blurry at finer spacings and the contrast has been blown out unnaturally around the edges. Same for the Note 8. It is clear that those phones are applying a noise reduction process to their image, then trying to sharpen it to enhance edges, which is why the contrast is higher but the resolution is lower.

Google has taken a more conservative, and accurate, approach to dealing with the image. We may be discussing different things. The iPhone 8 Plus has the same 12 MP resolution and f1.

They should be capturing images of roughly equivalent resolution. As noted, if you compare the pixel-level details, Apple is applying far too much sharpening to the images.

Anybody who has done image processing will have encountered this problem which actually leads to reduced resolution and artifacts. Sensor resolution is same, but optics quality is different.

Probably Apple and Samsung using cheaper lens. When iPhone got 94 — Dxomark is legit, the best and most professional test When Pixel 2 got 98 — Google paid you, dxomark is shit, blah blah blah..

Haters and fanboys always find a way to cry…. Of course, but to some people apple fanboys are the only fanboys that exist. I saw that people criticized DxOMark last year when the Pixel was the top rated phone, and also when the iPhone 8 Plus was the top rated phone.

It happened in both instances. A lot of it is personal preference as well. The iPhone 8 and 8 Plus can shoot 4K video at 60 frames per second. The Google Pixel 2 is limited to 30 frames per second in 4K.

The iPhone 8 and 8 Plus can shoot P video at frames per second whereas the Pixel 2 is limited to frames per second. Pixel can do either, and I do not see why Google would change that for Pixel 2. Yeah this is a pretty crucial feature.

And the iPhone x will have 60 FPS from the get-go. The problem is storage. So you have to record to internal storage and offload. The US model of the Note 8 at least only comes in a 64gb model and 4k at 60fps even with h.

You also cannot record directly to Google photos either so you still have to have a large amount of local storage. You also can use Google photos free lower quality storage for free on iOS. So Google photos as an offering in this case is sort of a moot point.

Especially when people who do not have a pixel and have android devices can save to a Youtube account archive and be none the wiser. The iPhone may not have a card reader but it too can offload footage when the device is full.

All existing media you take in those 3 years stays free. And three years is as long as people keep a phone really even less nowadays so it works out fine. Most slow motion, the cinematic type consumers are used to seeing in films is shot at fps then conformed to 24 fps.

Anything above this creates a very slow, slow motion that would bore most audiences to watch. The truth is as this point we are splitting hairs when it comes to image quality between the manufactures.

Why is that a disadvantage? When would you EVER need 4k at 60fps? You can prioritize the sharper frames in the final encode after editing when dropping the frame rate to get a better looking overall video.

There is a long list of things you can do with the added frame rate. Was this written before testing the Note 8? I have the note 8…great camera. I had the pixel and the note 7 last year and same was said.

I just want to say that using the camera the pixel was just so much more consistent. Could I get better photos from Galaxy at times…yes. That was just my feel last year.

That may be true…but the images from the original Pixel also wipe the floor with the Pixel 2. There is more detail in what I see. Colors can easily be tweaked. I mean even look at the comparison with the iphone with the girl looking over the edge….

What is with all the artifacts in the images? Why does it prioritize dynamic range over the actual subject of the shot? How much google paid u? Less noise on the iPhone cuz they applied more denoiser which will affect image quality.

The pixel 2 has slightly more noise but a lot more details. Girl is not out of focus what are you talking about? Also notice the much better dynamic range on the pixel whereas the lights on the iPhone and note 8 will be blown out.

I think Iphone have less noise because iphone software denoise photo much more than Pixel. Look that window line in Iphone isnt straight because of denoising. It dosent made Iphone photo better, but it is making it more unatural it is important what U want to achive.

I think when u will postproduct image from Pixel, U will get way better results than Iphone. About second photo, background is way better then Iphone. There arent any details….

One more thing… do U care about 60fps on 4K? U are filmaking some serious things? I undestand what gives 60 fps: I think comparing those things is like — 20 mpx is better than 12 mpx because U have bigger image and then saying that i cant use it to print hilarious big image… It always depends what do U need.

Okay, U are right. For good video quality, which is fluid and not choppy U need at least 30 fps, and Pixel has it. Which is smaller and more efficient file format, they have been doing FaceTime in H.

How can you do the comparison with different lighting condition? They should at least do same image with same conditions on all their reviews in order to compare… every review they did have different scene, which only makes them a big joke.

Nothing in the criteria scores of the Pixel 2 indicates a Where did that 99 final tally come from? As far as I can comparing individual images…How are these points weighted? That would be my guess.

People are going totally overboard with regards to the timing of the review. And remember the iPhone 8 went up immediately after the change in testing protocols so that looked funny too right? Sorry fanboys, have some dignity and deal with it.

Yup and they were idiots too. They work hard to do these tests. Real results tell the real story. This is a reference point. And real results on here easily show the pixel 2 won. We will see more reviews on YouTube shortly.

The results on here look like garbage. The original pixel looks better than the pixel 2 images. If you look at them up close there is weird blotches of areas that are super sharp and others that are blurry as hell with weird square artifacts.

Still a valid question btw. I would say very smart move from dxomark! Great marketing but bad for trust and objectivity. Really lost a lot of trust from me and many others. Fortunately there are some other phone camera reviewers out there really stepping it up like supersaf and phonearena.

He admitted two cameras do very natural looking photos and yet he chose Note 8 photo with huge yellow hue over the photo which looks horrible to have highest score.

I can be serious, they include multiple side by side pictures with crops for you to use your own eyes and come to your own opinion. The Note 8 objectively captures more detail in low light in all of those photos, period.

Seriously you should step back and evaluate your bias. Have you looked at the wide array of comparisons on the web? The iPhone has an exaggerated color bias, often making blue skies unrealistically blue.

Butt hurt is on iTARD fans like you. Are you serious, all Those Note 8 photos has huge yellow hue over the photo. Very bad looking photos. Not to mention much better night shots which puts it into a different league altogether.

Big yellow hue over photo, just like what shows in low light photos shows also in those daylight photos. As a photographer and graphic designer with trained eye it looks very bad.

Yes reality is dull, thats why you edit the photos later to direction where you want. Photos taking with DSLR also look dull because they look real and natural. I said this already, Note 8 does lot of post processing to trying to make photos look better than they really are, sometimes it works and sometimes not.

All those other three phones offered lot better natural overall look for photos. There is no yellow hue from any of those shots. Not sure what you are referring to. Not like the default camera app of the iphone one shutter button only.

Why do you care so much? The Note and the iPhone both have pretty good cameras. Beating eat other rout in different categories. Btw, I own both iPhone and Note 8. In a good position to speak on both platforms.

Not to mention, has a better default camera app with optional expert manual mode. Figure that one out. Aside from some having butt issues, I think everyone should look at the photos and decide which they like best.

If choosing a phone for the camera then they can make an educated purchase. Who really cares what the reviewer says as long as they show the photos? The Note 8 and iPhone 8 Plus were very close.

Note 8 edge out in front a bit because of OIS in the second camera. The Pixel 2 produces a decent thumbnail image but how can anyone look at these images up close and even some of the thumbnails and think it is a decent camera?

The first Pixel did a better job than the Pixel 2. I think as long as they show the pictures readers can decide for themselves which they like. It is subjective in some cases. So lets see, hmmmm…..

Apple kills it on portraits, Google on everything else. I wish I could buy an iPhone with the strengths of both the iPhone camera and the Pixel 2 camera! Yeah the pixel AI on the portrait mode is incredible, Apple portrait mode is already quite good but with pixel AI it will be even closer to a real camera.

Not hurt but expected. Shows you how much you know about the Pixel. No but their Mate 10 is coming out in a week. Skin tones are much better with iPhone. I know which one I would choose! I agree, but I also noticed the pretty women seemed to smile more in the iphone images.

Not that it matters, just pointing that out. I first thought that too. I give the overall bokeh effect award to the iphone for sure, but the color seems off from natural. I prefer to have an image closest to reality, then I can play with filters after if I wish.

I also opened both photos woman sitting in restaurant and enlarged, and noticed there is substantial loss of detail in the iphone picture! Same for her eyebrows, very smeared in the iphone shot.

Her hair too, much more detail in Pixels shot. The exposure is on the model, and the skintones also look more natural. But DxO only counted that the highlights on the background are better preserved in the Pixel Image.

In reality the people want to have a good looking image from the perople they photograph. I think every photo gallery now has filters even Microsoft galleries lol. And for that, more detail is better.

I also would disagree that her skintone is more natural on Apple pic, I think the opposite in fact. Apple is just doing it automatically for you, but forcing one particular filter that they deemed best, you have no choice in the matter, and lose facial details in the process.

I totally agree with you, iPhoneography is another world for android things, when compare against iPhone samples, it kinds of invites humiliation. Thank you for your suggestion.

We try and test as many phones as possible with our new protocol. There are many to come, so please holding on! Thank you for your understanding and patience. To match what Samsung and Apple is doing.

Mate 10 will do it, so will the x. At this level all the phone camera photos look great. It is a shame that the same mistakes were repeated for Miracast, since it on a theoretical plan should have been mirror phone screen to TV, but man did they fuck it up.

When you come to a review about a product review to discuss another product, you are a fan. When you are fan, a true fan, you become biased. The pictures look great.

What am I intended to get out of that? His entire premise is wrong in that DXO is trying to make it look scientific. I see no different between those reviews and this. I still feel my Lumia XL is better than most phones, after having compared the photos on a computer with Galaxy S7, Pixel, etc.

Pixel beats it in low light, but with 20 megapixel, day time photos in it is simply more usable. The Lumia camera module coupled with a modern SOC would be amazing.

Especially since I imagine they can shrink it down even further nowadays. No more excessive lag for the processor to capture and store the image. Still very curious how that camera performed in real world situations.

Up to this day i still see reviews popping up with vs modern flagship camera phones. Soon they will give and for pixle xl 3 phones next year out of If these are not paid reviews why dont you rate LG V30 phone which was released long back and available in market?

LG V30 is having best 1. LG V30 has the biggest aperture, thats good, but for phone camera, I think the software is more important.. Just read the review and look a the comments. Xenon flash rated worse than even poor led setups, photos done in 5MPx mode and zoomed instead of using native resolution or even 8Mpx oversampling.

I get it, is old outdated phone missing many features, video quality is behind modern cameraphones but its photo score is so biased that it even looks funny. OK, I am clearly uneducated here, but how do you get to a score of 99 on photo, when no single subscore is higher than 98?

A few are below That is some higher level math, I guess. It seems some of the sub-scores are weighted somehow. I recommend this dude: I closely examined these sample shots and compared them to the iPhone 8 Plus ones.

I think I can agree that in low light situations, of static scenes, the Pixel 2 does seem to be able to do a better job. Well you see the zoom score also better in iPhone 8 plus But for me the color is more accurate in Pixel 2 XL tbh.

You have to see the object yourself in real life before you can say anything about color accuracy: So you want to say that the model really looks like a Zombie in real life? Because in the Pixel Images she looks like one.

I am just glad in this age of smartphones, all are equally good at photos and videos. Still waiting for a phone that beats my Huawei P9 Plus in texture, noise and artifacts 85, 83, Those are the areas I care for the most.

The bokeh effect always tend to blur and leave a wrong sharp area I guess. Compared to other dual camera handphones. All these scores are meaningless. What this page is doing is essentially trying to quantify mobile camera performance via qualitative tests.

No scientific measurement at all except the video test. Each reviews are using different tests and samples. How is that fair? Here is how the tests are done: If you stand the same distance from your subject and digitally zoom so they fill the frame as if you used a telephoto, they will look the same perspective wise.

When most people talk about wide angle distortion, they are referring to perspective. Wide angles encourage photographers to get too close to the subject for portraits. Digitally zooming, or cropping in post, allows you to shoot from a more flattering distance.

Of course the resolution will suffer if you digitally zoom or crop, but the perspective will be fine. Straight vertical lines would form a shape of a barrel, hence the name. Conversely, telephoto lenses may suffer from pincushion distortion Barrel distortion can be corrected with software by warping the image inwards toward the center at the expense of cropping the corners.

Barrel distortion has little effect on a person in the middle of the frame even when there is no software correction. None of that would come into play when shooting a portrait with a wide angle from 5 or 10 feet and then cropping.

Try this with a zoom lens: Use a tripod from a fixed distance of say 6 feet. You need to make sure the camera is fixed to avoid tilting it more on one shot than the other.

Take a telephoto shot and then a wide angle. Crop the wide angle on your computer so the field of view matches the telephoto. Aside from it being lower resolution, there will no difference between the two shots.

I believe the reviewer was speaking of the way people think wide angles exaggerate facial features. Now if you try the same thing, but put your subject in the corner of the wide angle frame, you might see some effects of barrel distortion.

DXo seems to find these distortions significant enough to be worth mentioning. They will be more pronounced the closer or more off-center is the subject. You should do the test you mentioned on Pixel 2 when you get it.

I notice barrel distortion on faces with wide angle phone cameras very and I root for optical zoom or even interchangeable lenses on smartphones. I just felt that particular statement in the review was not put in a entirely accurate way.

Probably worth reading this tutorial on volume deformation, which explains quite a bit: You also get somewhat better subject isolation with the latter even without a specialized mode.

Those are two of the reasons that slightly longer lenses are favored by portrait photographers using standalone cameras. Pixel 2 is clearly the best rated camera yet. They specifically mentioned it in the review.

Otherwise, I like your sacarsm. I really was hoping for something remarkable from the Pixel 2, however, the Apple and Samsung photos are more pleasing in many ways.

I appreciate this site overall, but this review is not close to useful. The score, no matter how justified, is misleading. The Pixel images here are not impressive. When you use weighted scoring techniques for e.

Look at that tree picture. But, DXO says that the P2 has amazing detail preservation in light and dark shadows? Good luck finding any detail to bring out from that tree and trying to get rid of those intense blacks inside of it.

I am happy that my Pixel phone camera is still a great camera. That is quite impressive. But damnit, That first picture of the tree is hideous. It just seems way off on too many important things.

But to their credit, they do bring up good points about other things. I had the exact same impression on that photo htc 11 vs pixel 2 and i agree with you that the score seems to be a bit too high.

They saying the pixel has less noise than the last pixel but in my opinion it looks that it as or the same or even more. I agree that the HTC photo there does look better than the pixel 2, not sure whats up there.

Seems like the contrast was up to much on that scene. The pixel 2 though does have more detail than pretty much all the Iphone 8 photos in this review. As a photographer myself, Its easier to take a high detail photo, and convert it to what apple has as default in post processing if thats what you want, than it is to go the other way around.

Apple chooses to have softer more pleasing images at the expense of the detail. The real world pixel photos, have cool white balance and nasty bokeh. David had a shit body.

Shorter legs and less reach. Athleticism was on average with other men. Only difference was his brain. Transplant his brain and Goliath would definitely have beaten this crap guy in a fight.

And what you really are saying is that Samsung and LG sucks at software. If this is not the best sensor at this moment except for software, which do you consider the best sensor available at this moment?

The test results are very intransparent for people who just want to have a quick look about the camera test. You will se a 99 overall rating and think that the camera ist just perfect.

But if you read the full test you will see that the iPhone 8 Plus is much better in some categories. For me the rating is not intersubjectively understandable. DxO lost all credibility, and any article I see with them mentioned has fortunately only people aware of that.

Legit question — why have they lost credibility? I see a lot of hate for DXO, but have no idea where it comes from. DxO advertise themselves as being a consumer scoring company, which means they have a legal responsibility in being as informative and neutral as possible in the way they grade cameras, which used to be more or less the case.

I would like to see more systematic real-life test shots. Perhaps include a chart of some sort behind the person being photographed, for the shots to be more apples-to-apples.

OMG whatever the result some people complain. Dear Stephen, sorry to keep you waiting for approval. The moderation tool may be find you something suspicious in your sentences. But we solved that.

Dear Athar, thank you for your suggestion. All the shots are yellow. But i prefer android over ios…. S8 dont have 60fps n why u need 60fps! Take a look at LGV By far the best smartphone on the planet for video.

At 60fps its super wide angle where stabilization is less needed. And who makes the Pixel 2. LGV30 is the better phone. I have FHD 60fps as an option for my video size. Would send you a screen print but check yours.

Even standard HD 60fps video is just starting to look decent on high-end devices. We try and test as many phones as possible with our new protocol, please stay tuned! Colors, bokeh, noise, lens almost everything looks better in the iphone photos, so the final score is surprising!

The pixel 2 seems overrated to me, it has a lot of flaws the pictures are over processed, colors are better on the iphone, noise is visible in dark conditions, lens is bad for portraits, effects that do not work, I think it is overrated in this review and does not deserve the high 98 score.

Did you see the same photos as I did? Please take a look at the portrait photos indoor, indoor low light and outdoor, the difference is clear, iphone wins by a long shot look at the low light portrait, look at it also in full size to see the difference in noise.

When it comes to the lab photos however, you are right, the pixel 2 wins. This makes me question this whole review and the score as well. The noise performance and color reproduction by the iphone 8 in the portraits look much better, where the lab tests show a different story.

The apple photos seem warmer and more natural, which is probably why they look better to you. But the Pixel camera photos have far more detail, more dynamic range although at times can appear too contrasty for me and actually more accurate colors.

Devices with a secondary tele-camera, such as the Galaxy Note 8 or iPhone 8 Plus, are better in this respect. The distortion in the cropped center of a wide angle frame should be similar to a telephoto frame.

I think this is partially true. The parallax effect of a wide angle lens when you get really close to the subject and the nose looks big is NOT going to appear with digital zoom.

Some wide angles fish eyes most obviously — but many extreme wide angle lenses distort lines so they appear curved. That just has to happen — like the distortions in map projections that make Greenland look huge.

Either you get curves or you get scale distortions. All true, but I doubt the Pixel 2 has enough distortion to be noticeable in a digitally zoomed portrait. I agree that this statement in the review is vague and misleading.

What kind of wide-angle distortions is the reviewer referring to, and why not show an example? Is this an iPhone 8 ad? These comparisons and these numbers resonate the growing trend of a more educated market vs novice pixel-peepers.

Maybe you should get some glasses instead. The model in the Pixel 2 Images almost always looks like a Zombie, the tonal balance is off, the background blur bokeh looks like crap.

The comparisons above are not consistent and quality is dependent on what you are looking for. The sometimes use the Note 8 camera but I have the S8 and the camera is far superior than the attempts above.

I can make up for lack of light with longer exposure, but no skill can improve ISO performance. They can certainly factor in the fixed-lens aspect as well, but they already have a methodology for that.

This review is more frustrating than anything. Its all left on auto and these are the results. That is my assumption. This is fake dude: This is not proof at all: From where some extremely unknown guy has pixel 2?

There are many fast moving objects — the lights, the performer, etc. They are even from the very exact point of view: For years Android fans kept complaining about them when they where giving iPhone cameras high marks, now i guess the tables have turned.

I will not be putting my fate in some random Youtube guy if i where you. Oh and Samsung hired a lot of Nokia guys when Nokia was sold to Microsoft. They basically have an office across the street in Finland and ever since then they have been doing well on cameras.

Google Set up a whole unit dedicated to camera and that is how both caught up to apple. Please retest the One Plus 5 , and how the photo and video scores are calculated from the sub scores when there is not a single score above 98 so how these scores are calculated 99 and 96 respectively.

Can you please elaborate the procedure. Every honest person can see that the dollar bill and euro are much sharper than the pixel 2. Just look at the details. Please just be honest with yourselves and put your Apple hate aside.

Drowned in Apple-Hate much? It seems it needs to be clarified since such comments are solving the actual issue here and are very productive. In fact, I have never owned any version of any iPhone.

I have never had a use for one. I still use an old Samsung phone that is turned off, except for an emergency. For pictures my canon s95 and Sony a are what I use. However, lately, I have been thinking of joining the new generation; so I have been reading articles such as this.

And, I have to admit, looking at the images in this article with my totally inexperience, unbiased eye, this guy Jedro is absolutely correct. Look at the converging lines in the resolution test strip sitting on top of Lincoln in that close up.

There are other things besides pure resolution that make one image appear sharper than the other — like preservation of contrast and color fidelity. But just for resolving detail at this low light level?

Or have a look at YouTube comparisons between Note 8 and iPhone. No one talked here about resolution. You can have the best DSLR with a rubbish lens and yet you won't have the sharpest and detailed picture.

Apple chose to boost the contrast and clean up more noise in their image processing. That cost them some fine detail, but increased the apparent sharpness. Google not surprisingly made the geekier choice.

Pixel 2 easily best phone camera of all time. Powerful Android 8 operating system. OS updates from Google. Considerably cheaper than the iPhone X. Looks like we have a new phone champion here.

Lol ok buddy calm down.. Get your hands on a LG V30 then talk! The Bokeh example in this article is a nightmare. Bokeh is not just some random blur areas. It has some logic. I know this is not most important thing in the world, but they put stress on what great dual-pixel abilities their single camera has, and dxomark has seperate score just for this.

In theory, it gives the Pixel2 depth info for every single pixel on the sensor. On the web there are demos of producing 3d models from dual pixel sensor data. And, no one has had a chance to try this yet, but it probably tracks focus better than any other camera for video with a moving subject.

Dual pixel sensors have been in HTC and Samsung phones for a couple of years now. Also, I think all of these cameras are using Sony sensors. Google chose to leave more detail in the image at the cost of a more grainy appearance.

Look at the hair, for example, in the Note 8 shot. Just a big black area. A manufacturer would just jack up the noise reduction to get a better rating and throw away perfectly good pixels! In my opinion Some photo examples of Pixel 2 looks unnatural.

Like second and third image. Was the test conducted on both the Pixel 2 and the Pixel 2 XL? It should be the same specs all around. The Pixel 2 does appear to maintain a bit better detail, likely due to less post-processing.

It seems Apple have adopted the Samsung approach of sharpening images and such. Meanwhile the Note 8 is now softer with less sharpening. Dxo mobile camera test is always a joke! I have the Note 8 and I am honestly very disappointed in the camera because although the photos look nice when zoomed out, once you zoom in, you can see how it loses detail compared to even my Huawei Nexus 6p, a phone that is 2 years older and was meant as a cheap temporary phone to hold me over from the Note 7 fiasco to the Note 8.

The Nexus 6p captures sharper detail than the Note 8. The Note 8 only looks nice when zoomed out because of the saturated colors and oversharpening. HDR is on by default. The Nexus 6P was my best phone ever when it came to photos.

Funny enough, I am waiting for my Note 8 which I got primarily because of the photo mark scores so it sucks to hear that your real world scores are underwhelming.

I need a headphone jack so the iPhone and Pixel XL are automatically out. All my previous Galaxy flagships were plagued with stuttering and severe bugs.

I guess Samsung finally got their QC upto par with the Note 8. The camera is better than the stock Nexus 6P camera. The Nexus 6P with the modded NX Camera app is still not necessarily better than the Note 8 but just captures more detail than the Note 8 camera which is obvious when you zoom in on the image.

Thanks for the response! I tried it in the store against the iPhone 8 and it was fantastic screen. Like you I am looking to use it for productivity enhancement for a few years. On paper, OIS is a good thing, so if it can take good pictures, I will be happy.

How much did Apple pay DxO. Pixel 2 rated Its DxO and they test in the most professional way. But not even a mention about it.. Nice cherry picking of comments there.

It would be disappointing to find out if it scores at or better than the Pixel 2 because it would seem as though DXOmark would be working with Google on building it up.

Otherwise, probably range…. It seems that a triggered fanboi is in full libel mode. Clearly there is Samsung-esque sharpening now taking place. To the point it looks like S7 photos only less oversaturated….

This getting out of hand. DXO should get back to their roots. Most flagship smartphones can shoot in RAW. Please start doing your reviews by using RAW. All these noise versus detail including WB is affected by the camera software.

EVEN let people infer it. This is all really getting into wine snob type of behavior.. I just want to hear about 4K 30fps — is okay to record at all the time?

Should I just record at p 60fps? Only use 4K 30 fps if you have a screen that can display it, eg. The drawback is that it is only recording at 30 fps so scenes with lots of motion will have motion blur and may look worse than the 60 fps one.

However, this is just my opinion and other people might say differently. But 60fps is so pleasing to eyes.

Coments:

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